[LeeWay]

These little machines are in a class by themselves right now and at those prices, will probably be alone for some time. It is a niche that Defeng is attempting to fill. He has the product and the filling has at least started. I think he will get there.

[ChristianLL]

It's a real shame. I am going be starting a business and my mill budget is around $6,000 but can be pushed a few $1,000 if need really be. You can't get conventional VMCs in Australia for less than $20,000, and I only need a somewhat small work envelope. The SVM-1P is perfect.

Although I have a question, why is the SVM-2 only $300 more expensive than the SVM-1P. The pictures show the SVM-1P with coolant and such installed and the SVM-2 doesn't. Does the 'P' in SVM-1P imply extras from the base model? And if so, why is there no base SVM-1 on offer?

[ihavenofish]

i thought the p meant power drawbar.

[jips]

My order has been placed ! I will open a thread and a youtube channel when received waiting time now !

[skillalot]

Defeng is working on a USA dealer, once that is aranged things should go much smoother for US buyers I think.

[jips]

Defeng is working on a USA dealer, once that is aranged things should go much smoother for US buyers I think.

+1 the website will be updated soon too

[ChristianLL]

An Australian dealer would be nice, but Australia is the last major country you want to be in for cnc machinery I think.

I've been toying with the idea of building the machine I need. I'm about a 6.5/10 welder so I'd like to make custom castings instead, is it expensive to get custom castings made? Should I just take a shot at welding one up?

[LeeWay]

I know those two guys in Australia that are into cnc stuff. These are pretty much hobby class machines and are priced low. The larger ones are shooting for more production work, but I think Down under would be a great place to have at least one dealer. You guys are closer than we are to the source.

[ChristianLL]

I know those two guys in Australia that are into cnc stuff. These are pretty much hobby class machines and are priced low. The larger ones are shooting for more production work, but I think Down under would be a great place to have at least one dealer. You guys are closer than we are to the source.

I'm curious to see what hobby machines you're talking about, is there a website?
I hope the shorter distance inspires an Australian dealer. Maybe I should get Hare and Forbes (probably our biggest machinery house chain) to back this guy a bit.

At least we got all the cool Japanese cars in the 90s. Skyline R34, you jelly USA? :P

[ihavenofish]

An Australian dealer would be nice, but Australia is the last major country you want to be in for cnc machinery I think.

I've been toying with the idea of building the machine I need. I'm about a 6.5/10 welder so I'd like to make custom castings instead, is it expensive to get custom castings made? Should I just take a shot at welding one up?

custom castings are cheap and easy if you can make a pattern. machining them is another matter...

[handlewanker]

LOL.......welding one up......where have I heard that one countless times before?

First you need to determine the work envelope, then the actual design configuration.

One of the reason we want to get one from Skyfire is they're so damm much bang for the buck.

You could go down the path and do a retrofit, but go one further and mill off the dovetails and fit linear rails and ball screws.........then you start to get near CNC capability........this does not alleviate the fact that with any retrofit on a manual mill you toss half the brand new components away that cost you in the first place......and you still have a quill for the Z axis which is not all that suitable.

Best of British if you get to welding one up.
Ian.

[inov8r]

An Australian dealer would be nice, but Australia is the last major country you want to be in for cnc machinery I think.

I've been toying with the idea of building the machine I need. I'm about a 6.5/10 welder so I'd like to make custom castings instead, is it expensive to get custom castings made? Should I just take a shot at welding one up?

This post will give you an idea what it takes to weld one up. It can be done, but it's lots of work.
http://www.cnczone.com/forums/vertic...ing-large.html

[Tkamsker]

Hi question around 6k what is your requirements for that is it including PC , Screen , Vice tooling , Coolant etc ? or just the machine , And which work envelope is needed ?
Just because of interest

[high-side]

Christian, have you contacted Titan Machinery in Australia? They were carrying smallish SYIL mills w/ linears in that price range you mention.

Pat

[G59]

Do you really need linear rails? Linear rails are mostly put in for speed and reduced friction.

[why9faster]

I have not had any inconsistent communication with Defeng nor am I in the USA. Whereas, in response to my email to Tormach regarding the complexities of purchase, import tariff and the Form E that I will require, I received two sentences. If an escrow arrangement is made then Skyfire will not get paid until the goods are FOB, so until someone starts screaming that they have paid for a machine from Skyfire and not received it then there is no reason to imply otherwise.

This is not an established company. By any definition it is a startup and it is one that has a refreshing degree of openness and has endured a lot of teething problems. I think there are many readers, like me, who appreciate the quality that Defeng is trying to build into his machines. I also believe that the price reflects that this business is just growing. When it is fully established with a slick marketing and public relations department, I am sure that the purchase price will reflect that.
cheers

Glad you've received good communication, but I'm only referring to the multitude of comments by others via this thread. So if you have some good feedback from Defeng, maybe that should help his corner.

However, at this point you are correct that Skyfire is a startup and maybe Tormach hasn't exaclty responded with more than a few lines, I still would not even compare the two "businesses".

For any business to start accepting orders and take hard earned money, there is a certain level of trust or expectation. We cannot be expected to share in his "startup woes". If this is a real business model, then he needs to sort things out before accepting orders/money.

I would love to buy his machine but cannot fathom dropping 5k+ and playing a "..when will I get it, or if I get it" as this thread has documented so well already.

USA dealer would be an added benefit, but if the China office doesn't support him/her what is the sense? Same problems new face? Maybe that's why the price is so attractive and others so high? The cost of the machine hasnt yet combined with the cost of other ancillary but much needed business expenses.

[ihavenofish]

Do you really need linear rails? Linear rails are mostly put in for speed and reduced friction.

on a machine like this they are also for increased precision and rigidity. dovetails and box ways on big machines are great, but on little machines - in particular low end "frames" ones like most what you get in the 5-8k range - they are just a hindrance. the novakon torus pro would be one notable exception, as the dovetails are massive and of a unique design. that machine is $12000 though now. (and 1600lbs).

[louieatienza]

Do you really need linear rails? Linear rails are mostly put in for speed and reduced friction.

I think a vast majority of the problems in the retrofit benchtop mill world have to do with stiction and binding with the dovetail ways. That's not to say dovetail ways are bad, if the proper oil channels are machined in and the surfaces scraped they can exhibit very low friction. I work part time on a Bridgeport clone and I can turn the wheels with one finger despite that table being a couple hundred pounds. Very hard to duplicate that DIY however. Easier to duplicate with LM rails.

So does one need them? I'd say depends on the setup and work being done. For steel, with a low speed high torque spindle maybe not as necessary as with high speed spindle cutting aluminum.

[louieatienza]

LOL.......welding one up......where have I heard that one countless times before?

First you need to determine the work envelope, then the actual design configuration.

One of the reason we want to get one from Skyfire is they're so damm much bang for the buck.

You could go down the path and do a retrofit, but go one further and mill off the dovetails and fit linear rails and ball screws.........then you start to get near CNC capability........this does not alleviate the fact that with any retrofit on a manual mill you toss half the brand new components away that cost you in the first place......and you still have a quill for the Z axis which is not all that suitable.

Best of British if you get to welding one up.
Ian.

If someone buts a machine with the intent of ridding of unused components then so what? It's their money. The maker put cheap ACME screws in for a reason... they're cheap. And probably could be sold on eBay anyway.

As to weldments, aren't you building one for a small mill/router? There are a couple really nice ones in this forum.

For a lot of folks part of the retrofit is the experience of actual doing it. I've been fortunate to have received my machine and hope the other machines ship soon as well.

[ChristianLL]

I should probably clarify my current experience better before I start asking questions.

I already have a Sieg X2 converted to CNC with CNCFusion, Gecko Drive and 380oz-in steppers all-round. I didn't buy that machine with the intention of starting a business, I just absolutely loved the idea of CNC machining things so I bought the X2 and gave it all that DIY lovin'. I'm not done with it just yet, I was machining limit switch brackets for it today. However, now that I've decided to start a business, I need about 200mm in the Y, the X2 only has 94mm or there abouts. I can work with the X2 for the mean time, but I do need a bigger machine.

I want the machine to be reliable, but easy to work on myself. The SVM-1P fills the roll well. As for the desire for linear rails, from my understanding they're much lower maintenance than dovetails, and I'll be machine a lot of Aluminium, so production runs + aluminium = linear rails in my opinion. It's also a bonus that they're just awesome.

I've already started investigating design phylosophies for welded machines. Things like one big tube for a column is better for torsion strength, dampening issues, etc. I like David De Caussin's UMC 10 (who doesn't, seriously), people don't seem to mention that his column is chromoly when discussing his design. Anyway, my point is that I have actually looked into the path of welding a machine, I just wanted to ask the question to see what additional education people could provide me.

My $6k mark is just for the machine.