[gyronikeleg]

Hello!

I have just moved into a house with a nice two car garage that I plan on using for my PCNC 1100 when I purchase it in the coming weeks.

I have some concerns about shipping that I would like to sort out before I make my purchase:

I have a narrow driveway that leads into a neighborhood street (cars come in ~1 minute intervals). I have attached a rough drawing of the situation I am in.
My question is do you think that I will need to rent special equipment i.e. pallet jack, forklift to over come the hurdles my driveway presents. I don't think the truck will be able to make it down my driveway because the street is too narrow to make such a wide turn, plus my driveway is narrow.

Please advise!

Thanks,
Greg

[tmarks11]

You should be able to handle it with a pallet jack, if your driveway is paved and doesn't have much of a slope.

[SCzEngrgGroup]

I'm going to assume the units on the PDF are meters? In any case, unless it's inches, I don't see how a pallet jack will help you - it won't get up the "ramp", and it will be no help at all when it comes time to lift the machine onto its stand. I've moved quite a few milling machines now (I have three in my shop right now), and I MUCH prefer a forklift to any other means of moving them. I think it's the easiest, and by far the safest. As long as you're not in the middle of nowhere, rental should not be too expensive. I live in the sticks, and it costs me 2X as much to have the forklift delivered and picked up, as it does for the rental itself. One day rental is about $130, pickup and delivery about $320!. You want to get a "warehouse" forklift - the smaller the better. Anything bigger will not fit under your garage door. You should verify the clearance height before renting, as some garage doors are lower than others, and you'll be kinda screwed if you can't get the forklift inside the garage to put the machine on its stand.

A forklift is also really nice for getting the machine on the stand. I don't know about the Tormachs, but my Novakons have a hole laterally through the column, a few inches above table height. I slipped a pipe through that hole, and put the forks under both ends of the pipe, then used heavy cargo straps through the eye bolts on the front of the machine base, with the straps running over the forks. The pipe kept the machine level side-to-side, and I could then loosen/tighten the cargo straps to get the machine perfectly level, front-to-back and easily push/slide/rotate it slightly to get the mounting bolts lined up exactly, with confidence there was zero chance of the machine falling. I never have that level of confidence when a machine is hanging from an engine hoist. And, with this method there is almost no risk of damage to the machine, even paint scratches.

Regards,
Ray L.

[gyronikeleg]

Thanks for your replies!

The units on the drawing are in feet.

I guess I should consider forklift, even though it might raise some eyebrows in my neighborhood.

Thanks

[cncwelder]

I agree with Ray - something with forks is best. One other option to consider is a skid steer with quick attach forks - the smaller ones aren't too tall and will be more likely to fit through lower residential garage doors. The PC1100 has two through holes in the base that will accommodate 2 - 1 inch rods that you can put the forks under to lift the mill onto the base (that's how I sat my PC1100 on the base). [I'm fortunate in that my shop equipment door is 12x12 foot and I have a 13 foot ceiling. That lets me use the wheel loader to move bigger machines in the shop, but arranging a clear path is a pain.]
George

[wwendorf]

I would think a pallet jack would work just fine. I picked up a used 5 ton off craigslist for $80 when I got my mill. You might need another guy to get up the slope, but it should be doable if you have a buddy or two helping. I helped roll a machine up a similar slope at a buddy's place, and he had a 20' long 4' high ramp to go up to get into his shop.

Wade

[mountaindew]

I have a driveway that has a 8ft slope in 22 ft and was no effort at all to pull the machine crates into garage.
The lift gate to driveway was big step and that was no problem also.
After crates are in garage I could take my time and assemble with a engine hoist just like the many videos on youtube.
A fork lift could not have been used for any part of my assembly. Garage doors and ceiling heights are normal 7ft and 10 ft high and much to low for any type of lift.
Driveway has to much slope to assemble outside and move inside even If it would fit under the garage door!
Then again I use to rig for a living and assembly of a 1000 lb machine was not much work. imho and I did it with no help. just took my time and used my brain.
md

To add to my experience.
This is not a 1 time thing for delivery company! most the time they are well aware of delivery conditions!
They drag pallets of things that weigh 3x what that tormach weighs with little effort!
The delivery guy wanted to drop in street and take up curbs and said it would be no problem!
I did not want to bounce everything around that much! and had him block street to put gate on driveway.
then like I mentioned above the gate to drive was a big bump! and into garage 2 seconds later simple.!

[SCzEngrgGroup]

A pallet jack would never make if up the "ramp" at the street end of the driveway. If it's really as shown in the drawings, with a 1 foot rise in the first 4-1/2 feet, it will bottom out going over the "crest", and probably also crossing the drainage channel at the curb.

Regards,
Ray L.

[wwendorf]

Yes it would, if you raise the jack up to it's highest point and have some friends to help stabilize it.

[Don Clement]

When my 1100 was dropped off at the bottom of my driveway I used a simple come-a-long and pry bar to move it up my steep driveway. No special equipment needed.

Don Clement

[cncwelder]

I really don't want to get into an argument about the "right way" to move/place the Tormach - whatever works safely for you is great. But for informational purposes only, I'll point out that smaller skid steer loaders will fit under (many) lower garage doors. The old Bobcat 743 had a height to top of EROPS of 75.8 inches (rated load 1300 pounds, tipping load 2600 pounds). The more recent Bobcat S150 has a height to top of EROPS of 76.3 inches and a rated load of 1500 pounds (tipping load 3000 pounds). Remember skid steers have no mast that must fit under a garage door and the fork backguard height is about 3 feet (less than the height of the mill).
Since you are lifting from the base of the mill (using the holes for 1 inch bars), necessary vertical clearance is significantly less than if lifting with chain from above (and is approximately the height of the installed mill column). Again - just additional information for consideration - do what's best for you. George

[Don Clement]

It really is amazing how much a simple pry bar can move.
machinery pry bar - Bing Images

[GJeff]

Lol, Don's pic is great. Beautiful looking area too. I wouldn't mind living around there if not for the Cali state taxes.

and +1 on the pry bar. After I had my machine set in place on the table, using a pallet jack to position it to it's final resting place, I had issues with backlash that required me to get behind it. I thought I'd have to rent another pallet jack, but then I reacquainted myself with the power of leveraged and used a long pair of 2x4's (because my attempt to use a single one resulted in a broken piece of wood) wedged underneath the table near the feet to lift and pull the whole stand inch by inch, alternating sides, until I had it a good foot or two from the wall. With a large enough lever you can move anything other than the firm opinion of another forum poster.

[MFchief]

Everyone is offering up good ideas for various options. I would just point out that unless you have some sort of hoist, like an A frame or engine hoist to get the mill on the stand, you are going to have to rent a forklift twice. That's assuming you are using a Tormach stand and will need to assemble it prior to mounting the mill.

It might be cheaper to buy a Harbor Freight type engine hoist than to rent the forklift. Just remember that would require a chain type lift instead of the bars thru the mill base, so you would need to insure you have adequate ceiling clearance in you garage.

Good Luck
Terry

[SCzEngrgGroup]

Everyone is offering up good ideas for various options. I would just point out that unless you have some sort of hoist, like an A frame or engine hoist to get the mill on the stand, you are going to have to rent a forklift twice. That's assuming you are using a Tormach stand and will need to assemble it prior to mounting the mill.

It might be cheaper to buy a Harbor Freight type engine hoist than to rent the forklift. Just remember that would require a chain type lift instead of the bars thru the mill base, so you would need to insure you have adequate ceiling clearance in you garage.

Good Luck
Terry

I don't understand why you'd have to rent a forklift twice. Surely the Tormach can easily be unloaded and setup in a single day? I've been able to do it with all the machines I've ever owned - typically about four hours from when the truck arrives until the machine is powered up and ready to run.

Regards,
Ray L.

[MFchief]

You might be right Ray, I was just thinking about the time it takes to assemble the deluxe stand with mechanical assembly and sealing the panels with silicon. Typical installation in a residential garage means the machine goes up against a wall, so the stand work needs to be done before final placement. Perhaps that could be accomplished with pry bars or a come along?

Terry

[SCzEngrgGroup]

You might be right Ray, I was just thinking about the time it takes to assemble the deluxe stand with mechanical assembly and sealing the panels with silicon. Typical installation in a residential garage means the machine goes up against a wall, so the stand work needs to be done before final placement. Perhaps that could be accomplished with pry bars or a come along?

Terry

Moving the machine is easy, if slow, with a pry bar and some blocks of wood. I've moved all of my machines, including my 2500 pound knee mill, as much as 25 feet using nothing else. So, if time is an issue, get the machine on its stand first, and everything else can be done without the fork lift.

Regards,
Ray L.

[Don Clement]

I didn't have the overhead for an engine hoist when moving my 2.2K lb lathe up 2 ft and over 4ft into my shop so I rigged an I beam with A frame and HF 1ton trolley. I also had to move the lathe on a sled made of 4x4s up 30ft driveway using block and tackle with my Toy truck pulling on the rope.

Don Clement

[LSM]

Pallet jack and an engine hoist or A frame.
I bought a HF pallet jack when I set up my pcnc 1100.
it has come in handy for other thing that need moving around in the garage.
works great for my omni turn lathe

some tie down straps and a come-along can get you up or down a slope.
Or you can get 4 strong men to just muscle it

pry bar and some 3/4 inch pipes can more quite a bit.

Mostly you just have to use your head and not try and defy the laws of physics

Down side of forklift is it may or may not fit in a garage depending on the mast hight.

then if you can't get the delivery truck in the driveway, it is possible to pick it up at the freight terminal with a trailer and just back that into your garage.
many different ways to skin that cat

[gyronikeleg]

Thanks for all the advice! What I have taken away from this, and watching some delivery videos is that it is best to talk to the delivery people before they come and figure out the best way to approach this.

Coincidentally today I had a fridge delivered and the truck could not make it up the driveway. Obviously a fridge on a dolly is a lot easier than a 1300 crate on a pallet jack, but the moving guys were able to get over the obstacles at the front of the driveway with ease. My hope is to have the truck back up so the machine can be placed past the initial hurdles. Time is somewhat of an issue because the street is not deserted.

Thanks again!