[JMOlshefski]

I am an experienced woodworking with good PC skills, and have been looking to add a CNC machine to my shop for woodworking. I looked at the Rockler Piranha, Rockler Shark HD, Legacy, and now Probotix I like the Piranha because of the price but do not want to say late ‘Wish I would have spent the money on the larger table”. But too many options and not sure of the Shark, verse the Legacy verse the Probotix? And then there is the software Cut2D verse VCarve pro etc, etc. I looking to make a good investment

[mmoe]

Is this a business investment or a personal investment? What do you hope to make on your machine? Software will also depend a bit on those factors as well.

[JMOlshefski]

It is a hobby / craft I make wooden, clocks, boxes, banks, and other wooden item for craft shows.
Joe

[JMOlshefski]

Work area, plan around a 4 by 4 foot area (flexible) / Cutting thickness can range from 1/16th on an inch up to 1 1/2 inch hardwood / not sure what you mean by "How is the processing precision of your product?" if you are talking about tolerances then like 1/64th of an inch.

[mmoe]

I don't envy you, that's for sure. Finding a good value for using as a hobby is not going to be easy, especially in that size. If it were for business, I'd recommend spending 3 or 4 times what you're probably currently budgeting, but the justification is that you'll make that back in pretty short order. Since that's not really going to happen at a hobby level (unless you sell a lot at craft shows), I'll take it that your budget (based on what you referenced) is somewhere around $4k for the machine at the high end and $700-900(ish) for the software?

Here's a guy in Seattle that builds some pretty nice machines. I'm not sure what his pricing is like, but I do think that it would be worth stretching your budget a little bit if you can to get a machine built like this. There is a guy on CNCZone who bought the machine in the pictures and builds guitars with them, and I'm sure he'd be willing to talk with you about the builder. I believe he uses a kflop and Kmotion software for the controller, which is a pretty nice system. The machines have profiles bearings (as opposed to round), dual gantry lead screws to prevent racking and seem to be well built overall. The second link is a thread about the machine by the owner I'm talking about.

CNC Routers 2x2-4x4

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/commer...ml#post1553564

Again, I don't know this guy, so buyer beware, but I don't think it is any more risky than something from Ebay, etc. and you can ask some of his customers what it was like to work with him. If anything, it seems like he takes pride in making a quality product, which is always a good sign. The advantage is that he can probably customize the machine a bit, which might really make it a good value. Since you are more of a hobby user, I think I would be looking at the option of a machine built to be 24"x48", but with the 48" between the gantry (49-50 inches of open table ideally) so that you could slide material through the table and cut parts larger than the 24"x48" allows. If you built an infeed and outfeed table for it, you could probably machine parts up to a full 4x8 sheet long with a reasonable degree of accuracy while also saving some money on the machine. Here's a video showing how you can index a sheet and machine beyond the size of the table (mine is a very large 4'x4' machine, but same concept would apply):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HhduqZ2OTqc

For software, either V-Carve Pro or Bobcad with Bobart are probably going to be ideal. Bobcad's pricing on their website is not what you'd pay if you contact them, and I think you'd get more for your money with Bobcad than V-Carve since it also includes 3d toolpath strategies and a little more overall power once you learn to use it. If you negotiate well, Bobcad Mill Standard with Bobart is less than V-Carve with 3D Cut. V-Carve is easier to learn and excellent for 2d and Vcarve operations, which is really it's biggest selling point. You can do everything that V-Carve Pro does in Bobcad with Bobart (Bobart is a module within Bobcad that provided V-Carve and art related functionality), but it will take twice as long to get to a similar level of proficiency. Once you get to that point, Bobcad would provide a great deal more that it can do than even the combination of V-Carve and 3D Cut, and at a lower price while also being a single program that can do both functions before you post process your G-code program (you have to do it separately in V-Carve/Cut3d). Bobcad and V-Carve both provide trail software that allow you to learn them before purchase, so you can spend as much time as needed to determine what works for you. The Bobcad forum here is very active and helpful, and I think that Vectric has their own forum which is quite active as well, so either way you have some resources.

[ger21]

I'm with mmoe here. Most machines under $5K are little more than toys.
Probably a better machine than what your looking at it the XZero. You'll need to assemble it yourself, and do your own wiring. Be aware that he's been known to be a bit slow in shipping, but I think he's gotten much better lately.
If you can spend a little more, Camaster is a very popular option, and much more machine than any of those.

I'd recommend V-Carve Pro myself, but everything mmoe said is correct. But there are far more V-Carve Pro users doing woodworking than BobCAD (imo). But again, try the demos and buy what YOU like best.

[mitechcnc1]

You can choose the stepper motor with your processing precision.
I agree with mmoe, as the common saying, you get what you pay. If it were for business, I'd recommend choose better machine. Better machine are very few failures, they can save your time, amount to help you earn money.
About your working area is 4 by 4 foot(1219*1219mm), 1313 (1300*1300mm) model is common style for most factory. Of course, also you can customized bigger style.
Hope they are workable for you.

[aarggh]

As others have mentioned, any Vectric product is always a good choice, it's pretty rare you'd hear anyone complaining about their products, except maybe the price. For wood workers V-Carve or Cut2D/3D are great packages.

So far as machines go, I'd steer clear of any of the Sharks or Piranha's, unless thousands of dollars for machines largely made out of plastic and unsupported rails is appealing. I had the chance to check a couple of models out, including the "beefed up" Shark Pro, and I can say I've never been so underwhelmed by such expensive but inferior built machines before. For ad-hoc simple turnkey stuff they would possibly be "adequate", but I would never consider them of any value in any form of business generating revenue, especially given the flimsy construction. They make the cheap Chinese machines look amazingly good value and quality!

Paying a little extra to get a good machine really does work out cheaper in the end.

cheers, Ian

[magicrobots]

JMOlshefski, I'd be happy to talk to you about the unit I'm selling, and provide my own experience of searching for the right starting point. Private message me if you're interested in talking and I'll give you a call. I know it feels like a swamp at first. We went through several rounds of research before landing on the unit we use now and almost made some mistakes in terms of overall and long term quality.

Additionally, with the Chinese units and some of the almost-plug-and-play kits, you will get no personal tech support (which is invaluable), but we've had an excellent experience with our vendor.