[BAMCNC.COM]

How did I miss this????

[SCzEngrgGroup]

Hey Ray,

How's the machine working ?
You get some serious machining time in on it yet?

Joe

Joe,

I've used it quite a lot, and it's worked flawlessly. It is now busy building it's own off-spring. I've completely re-designed both the PDB and ATC, making both MUCH smaller, and lighter, while adding significant capability.

The PDB will now be about 3-4X faster, about 1/4" the size and weight, well under 1/2 the cost, while retaining full capability - up to 35 ft-lbs on the drawbar. The whole mechanism fits in the palm of my hand - the "footprint" on the machines head is only 2" x 3.5", including the integrated spindle lock.

The ATC goes from 10 tools to 12, with a fixed, servo-driven carousel - out of the way behind the table - and a high-speed, servo-driven transfer arm to move tools between the spindle and carousel. The carousel has been reduced from 14" to 10" in diameter. The transfer arm also incorporates programmable coolant nozzles.

Both PDB and ATC are loaded with sensors, so every single action can be confirmed, and operation halted if anything goes wrong, so it should be dead-reliable. If anything ever does go wrong, the controller will identify *exactly* what the fault is, and notify the user both through the control program, and through an LCD display on the embedded PDB/ATC controller. The PDB and ATC incorporate only a single air cylinder each, making them very small, very quiet, and reliable.

The interface to the control PC will be through a single USB port.

Perhaps the most unique aspect of both parts is the ease of installation - Both the PDB and ATC can be adapted to virtually any mill, from an X2 to a full-sized VMC, with nothing more than a couple of very simple mounting brackets, making it a nearly "universal" solution. Due to the low-cost, it will be able to "retail" for MUCH less than any comparable ATC out there.

I am busy building the prototype right now. The PDB will see its first use this week, the ATC is a few weeks behind - both waiting for a few critical components, and my new mill, to show up.

Regards,
Ray L.

[BAMCNC.COM]

Time to retire

[SCzEngrgGroup]

Time to retire

I am retired....

[MRM RCModels]

NEED VIDEO!!!!!!!

[SCzEngrgGroup]

NEED VIDEO!!!!!!!

I'll do a video once everything is working.

Regards,
Ray L.

[zero_divide]

Good job Ray.
ATC looks simple, but i can only imagine how its like to put all this stuff together.
I have been quietly following this thread for a little bit and maybe i have missed the answers to my questions.

It seems like both the quill and table can move in Z axis, Is there a reason for that
Could you utilize quill z axis move to lower and grab the tool, while table up-down movement would provide z travel for machining?
This way you could have made ATC even simpler as there would be no reason for the whole carousel to move up and down...
This would also make for a more rigid machine as you could machine with quill all the way up.

[SCzEngrgGroup]

Good job Ray.
ATC looks simple, but i can only imagine how its like to put all this stuff together.
I have been quietly following this thread for a little bit and maybe i have missed the answers to my questions.

It seems like both the quill and table can move in Z axis, Is there a reason for that
Could you utilize quill z axis move to lower and grab the tool, while table up-down movement would provide z travel for machining?
This way you could have made ATC even simpler as there would be no reason for the whole carousel to move up and down...
This would also make for a more rigid machine as you could machine with quill all the way up.

Eldar,

If you like this one, wait until you see the new one! Any one want to buy a slightly used ATC? :-)

It has to do with maintaining as much clearance as possible between the work and the tools in the carousel when the carousel is moving. On my machine, with a maximum length tool (1/2" drill in keyless chuck), and a maximum height workpiece, I'd run out of vertical clearance real quick. Without the "lift", the carousel would have to swing in and out about 1.5" lower down than it does now. That would mean you'd have to be a lot more careful where your work was w.r.t. the path of a fully loaded carousel, and you'd likely end up having to do toolchanges off to one side of the table, so fewer things could get in the way. Right now, I can do a toolchange in any position, as long as the carousel clears the RH wall of the enclosure.

Plus, if the tool doesn't go into the spindle properly, you'd break the tool fork every time, and/or lose position on the quill, since the quill would be unforgiving. The "lift" is spring-loaded, so if a jam occurs, nothing gets broken - the spring just compresses, limiting the force on the tool fork. The "lift" mechanism really does not add significant complexity, and avoids these problems. In all the time I've used this ATC, I've only broken two forks (well, really just the plastic screws holding them in), and those were both during early testing, not actual use.

Using the knee as the Z axis is painfully slooooooooow, especially when peck drilling, as you're moving almost 700# of cast iron. Mine moves at only about 60 IPM, while the quill will do 300 IPM. And the knee is not nearly as accurate as the quill. The quill on this machine is actually quite "tight", and has no discernable play, even when extended the full 5". Most of the work I do has it extended only about 2", where rigidity is really not an issue.

My new ATC gets around these issues in different ways, maintaining the same advantages of this design, but with the carousel in a fixed position, completely outside the work area. Only the one tool being loaded/unloaded makes the trip from the carousel to the spindle, and it can do that at maximum height, then drop down only as it approaches the spindle, so very little clearance is required. In fact, I could easily make it swing in ever higher if I wanted.

I got my new PDB operating today, albeit with manual sequencing, since I'm missing a few essential electronic bits. Overall, it works very nicely for a first article - better than I dared hope. There will be a few minor tweaks in the final version - mostly just small changes in dimensions here and there.

Regards,
Ray L.

[CNC-Joe]

Joe,

I've used it quite a lot, and it's worked flawlessly. It is now busy building it's own off-spring. I've completely re-designed both the PDB and ATC, making both MUCH smaller, and lighter, while adding significant capability.

The PDB will now be about 3-4X faster, about 1/4" the size and weight, well under 1/2 the cost, while retaining full capability - up to 35 ft-lbs on the drawbar. The whole mechanism fits in the palm of my hand - the "footprint" on the machines head is only 2" x 3.5", including the integrated spindle lock.

The ATC goes from 10 tools to 12, with a fixed, servo-driven carousel - out of the way behind the table - and a high-speed, servo-driven transfer arm to move tools between the spindle and carousel. The carousel has been reduced from 14" to 10" in diameter. The transfer arm also incorporates programmable coolant nozzles.

Both PDB and ATC are loaded with sensors, so every single action can be confirmed, and operation halted if anything goes wrong, so it should be dead-reliable. If anything ever does go wrong, the controller will identify *exactly* what the fault is, and notify the user both through the control program, and through an LCD display on the embedded PDB/ATC controller. The PDB and ATC incorporate only a single air cylinder each, making them very small, very quiet, and reliable.

The interface to the control PC will be through a single USB port.

Perhaps the most unique aspect of both parts is the ease of installation - Both the PDB and ATC can be adapted to virtually any mill, from an X2 to a full-sized VMC, with nothing more than a couple of very simple mounting brackets, making it a nearly "universal" solution. Due to the low-cost, it will be able to "retail" for MUCH less than any comparable ATC out there.

I am busy building the prototype right now. The PDB will see its first use this week, the ATC is a few weeks behind - both waiting for a few critical components, and my new mill, to show up.

Regards,
Ray L.

Wow, Ray- can't wait to see it. No wonder we haven't heard much from you - you've been busy!

Share some pics and video with the rest of us when you get it done.

Joe

[neilw20]

I've just looked at the Kflop and planning on ordering. I can see why you need one Ray. I'm waiting for your new video too. PDB still a stepper or a linear motor?

[SCzEngrgGroup]

I've just looked at the Kflop and planning on ordering. I can see why you need one Ray. I'm waiting for your new video too. PDB still a stepper or a linear motor?

Neil,

The new one is, effectively, a servo motor.

Regards,
Ray L.

[SCzEngrgGroup]

Neil,

BTW - If you get a KFlop, I can give you all my DSP code (There's quite a lot of it at this point) as a learning aid, or starting point for your own. You'll find the most difficult thing about KFlop is understanding how all the parts fit together, and how to implement all the things you need to implement. The example code that comes with it is often poorly documented (sometimes mis-leadingly commented....). I tried to keep mine fairly clean, simple, and easy to understand (because otherwise I wouldn't be able to understand it....).

Regards,
Ray L.

[neilw20]

Thanks Ray,
5:38 am here. Must go to bed!!
Do you know the spindle center to motor clearance?
I am getting a stepper/gearbox 60 ft.lb capable. Waiting on delivery. Definitely the way to go. I bet the 25x25 cylinders beat the motor to my mailbox. Is 25x25 OK?
Thanks
Neil

[CNC-Joe]

Ray, from the sounds of things - you have definitely incorporated a lot of improvements into an already robust machine.

Sounds like a definite market contender.

I'd say - Look out Tormach - you've got some competition coming.



Joe

[SCzEngrgGroup]

Thanks Ray,
5:38 am here. Must go to bed!!
Do you know the spindle center to motor clearance?
I am getting a stepper/gearbox 60 ft.lb capable. Waiting on delivery. Definitely the way to go. I bet the 25x25 cylinders beat the motor to my mailbox. Is 25x25 OK?
Thanks
Neil

The clearance from spindle centerline is 1" to either side along the short axis, about 1-1/8" if the spindle lock is included. Along the long axis it's just under an inch on one side, just under 2.5" on the other.

25 x 25? Is that 25mm diameter x 25mm stroke? If so, that should be adequate, if you're careful with dimensions.

Regards,
Ray L.

[SCzEngrgGroup]

Ray, from the sounds of things - you have definitely incorporated a lot of improvements into an already robust machine.

Sounds like a definite market contender.

I'd say - Look out Tormach - you've got some competition coming.



Joe

Joe,

It is my hope to sell these as an add-on to a wide range of milling machines. That was the motivation for designing it as I did - it is incredibly easy to adapt to virtually any machine, from an X2 up to "big iron". Also incredibly easy to expand the number of tools, switch over to 30-taper, etc. In fact, a 30-taper change-over would require swapping out only a handful of simple parts.

Regards,
Ray L.