[SIG]

What holders and collets or disks do you prefer when drilling with thru coolant?

[big_mak]

I dig ER collets with the rubber seals, then you don't have to fart around with the disks!

that's my $.02

[dertsap]

DA and ER are my preferance for smaller sized drills , though with DA collets i do find there is more farting around with them to get the drill dialed up dead nuts, sidelock for all else

[big_mak]

Side lock is condemned in my shop!!!!!

[dertsap]

Side lock is condemned in my shop!!!!!

why"s that ?

[big_mak]

side lock = run out
run out = premature wear

[dertsap]

when i say larger drills i am refering to a heavy sized drill ,generally 1" shank plus , i find if it's a decent holder then the drill will dial up fairly well , on many of the jobs we have we are plowing thru steel plate and these tool move fast , if we try runnig the larger drills in anything other than a sidelock then the drill will spin in the holder and break .

i do agree about premature wear with runout , ive seen many burned drills after only a small number of holes because someone was in to much of a hurry to clock it

[big_mak]

I've used standard ER collets and thru coolant for milling deep slots and Parts the need to be pretty.

For them big drills, yah you need side lock or your in big poop. That simply can't be avoided.

I've used thru coolant lots. I regret not getting it on the machine I bought for myself. Hind sight we all know.... 20/20.

At the same time with a 10K spindle I'm now wishing I got a mist collector. With 10K and thru coolant a mist collector is a must have.

The answer for collets is still ER series for me. Unless you can spring for shrink fit, or hydraulic, or the BIG Mega Chucks!!!!!!

I just sprang for some ultra precision ER chucks from techleader. Dropped in a half inch endmill and clocked it in the spindle 0.0002" run out, measuring on the cutting edges. Who do I blame for this? the endmill or the holder. JK

Finish was amazing in 7050 Ally!!!!

[dertsap]

. Dropped in a half inch endmill and clocked it in the spindle 0.0002" run out, measuring on the cutting edges.
Finish was amazing in 7050 Ally!!!!

hard to beat er holders , tg are good as well ,they hold pretty solid , i'm not sure if they make them with the rubber in the collets for thru spindle , ive just used them (tg)with thru spindle on endmills for chip evacuation ,lots of coolant pours thru the slits of the collet

At the same time with a 10K spindle I'm now wishing I got a mist collector. With 10K and thru coolant a mist collector is a must have.
!!!!

coolant mist tastes great when a guy has to be popping his head in the machine every so often , doesn t it ?

[big_mak]

Doesn't help with getting any action when you get home wreaking of Valcool, Blaser, Oemetra or what ever you use!!!!!

[SIG]

Thank you for the responses.

[fmari]

Here is the most common collet chuck that I sell. CAT40-ER32. You can't beat my price and quality. Concentricity between the outside taper and the inside taper is .0001 or less. Balanced to G2.5-20,000 rpms. The nice thing about ER collet chucks is that you don't need to carry too much inventory. I make and sell floating tapping heads that take ER collet and straight shank ER collet chucks. I use these almost all the time in my machine shop. I use it for 3/4 carbide endmills with no issues. My collet nuts are solid and not the bearing type. Bearing style collet nuts sound nice on paper but in reality they crack too easy and they get contaminated with coolant and chips. I sell separately ER collet nuts and I sell them all the time to people replacing their bearing style collet nuts. So far I have 2000 of these in the US. Not a single complaint.

[SIG]

Here is the most common collet chuck that I sell. CAT40-ER32. You can't beat my price and quality. Concentricity between the outside taper and the inside taper is .0001 or less. Balanced to G2.5-20,000 rpms. The nice thing about ER collet chucks is that you don't need to carry too much inventory. I make and sell floating tapping heads that take ER collet and straight shank ER collet chucks. I use these almost all the time in my machine shop. I use it for 3/4 carbide endmills with no issues. My collet nuts are solid and not the bearing type. Bearing style collet nuts sound nice on paper but in reality they crack too easy and they get contaminated with coolant and chips. I sell separately ER collet nuts and I sell them all the time to people replacing their bearing style collet nuts. So far I have 2000 of these in the US. Not a single complaint.

I didnt see any specific to thru coolant. They do look nice, does anyone here
have experience with these?

[dertsap]

not impressed with the solid nut

[fmari]

not impressed with the solid nut

No problem. When your bearing nut cracks or doesn't rotate smooth you can buy a replacement from me.

Yes all my tapered tool holders have coolant-thru capabilities but my drill chucks. I have sold many holders to members of the practical machinist forum. Do a search and you will find many happy customers.
http://www.practicalmachinist.com/ub...35.html#000000

Some of my initial customers were skeptical because my prices are so low. But once they order 1 and have a chance to try it out, they always order more. I deal in large volume. I normally stock 300 pcs of just CAT40-ER32 chucks. I also stock 300 sets of er32 collet sets and 200 sets of er16 collets. I make small margins but I make it up in volume.

[dertsap]

No problem. When your bearing nut cracks or doesn't rotate smooth you can buy a replacement from me.

.

ive never had that problem ,never had one crack and i like to keep the tools clean, i've been doing this long enough not to be sold on a pitch
i wasn t knocking your product , i was just answering the gentlemans question

[fmari]

It is great you are having good luck with using bearing nuts. I am nut using a sales pitch. I am just stating what I have seen and experienced first hand.

For first I own a machine ship near Chicago. I have 12 cnc lathes all with live tooling and I also have 14 cnc mills all with 20 or 40 tool, tool changers. On several occasions I've had a bearing nut crack and have all the ball bearings splatter around the machine. Luckily I had the door closed.

Secondly as a manufacturer and seller of tool holders I sell a lot of collet nuts. Yes just the nuts. 80% of the people that buy them are replacing broken bearing nuts. The other 20% are just buying nuts to replace lost ones. So I am not the only one by far with the same problem.

Also unless you are running prototype work these bearing nuts will get contaminated. Try running a bearing nut in high speed or just medium speed drilling and milling with coolant. Over time sludge will get inside. Sure it still might rotate but not as freely as new. Coolant contamination is a fact of life. If it wasn't spindle bearing rebuilders would be out of business since over 90% of bearing failure is due to contamination.

[dertsap]

you forgot to meantion the cost efficiency of producing a solid nut
as with all tooling it must be creaned on a regular basis , there is a point to having bearings

something i picked up from the net:

ER collet nuts

The friction-bearing design of ER Collet Nuts for high precision and high-speed applications allows for extremely high clamping forces without the need to over-tighten. The large cross-section between the nut and race provides the durability of a solid nut with the increased clamping force and concentricity of a bearing nut. An expanded life of the nut results from both the heat treating process that provides a wear-resistant surface and the low friction that reduces forces from twisting the top of the collet.

[fmari]

Sure the bearings are much easier to make. And my price reflects that.

I agree with the above statement, but only when it is new. I don't care how much you clean it, stuff will get inside. What if you are running a job of 10,000 pcs. Are you saying you should stop the job halfway, take apart all your holders clean the nuts and put it back together and continue. My collet nuts perform the same when new or old. Bearing nuts do not last as long and when old they don't rotate or if they do rotate not freely and if you pay attention while tightening they bind and become a solid nut.

Also bearing nuts cannot be balanced. Sure you can balance them. But after a couple of clampings and unclampings they lose balance. Because the nut is at the farthest point and is one the the biggest diameters on the holder this is a very critical flaw.

I am not here to argue about bearing nuts or solid nuts. I am just trying to say that sometimes it is better to leave well enough alone. Solid nuts are very cost-effective, very reliable, very durable, much more durable than bearing nuts. Solid nuts can be balanced much better than bearing nuts. These facts cannot be argued.

[dfstrasser]

Schunk Tendo hydraulic for drilling and finish milling. Runout is almost non-existent. For roughing, their Sino-R is excellent.