[rszemeti]

Hi,

We have recently picked up a Multicam PRO (10'x5') machine and it seems really nice ...

Everything works, it references fine and can be jogged etc etc ... except ... the serial cable.

There was at some time a 25 way D type connector on the side of the machine .. all that is left is a cut cable that goes back to the controller card, where it terminats in an RJ45

The machine is older .. so I think it is unlikley it is ethernet ... we have the full wiring diagrams, but, for soem reason, this cable was not documented on our machine.

Multicam were kinda helpful, but did not seem to have any info beyond sending a PDF of the same diagrams we already have

if anyone out there has an older PRO machine with the Extratech M23 interface boards, and could take a photo of the back of the 25way D type, on the side of the machine, that would probably solve our issues. The RJ45 end is wired in "standard" order, so a photo of the back of the 25way D type so we can see the colour codes fo the wires would allow us to work it out.

much appreciated if anyone can help.

[keesfrees]

did you make any progress yet ?
this is not really a multicam issue, just a general serial connection thing
which come's in a lot of varieties :-///

Category:Serial Cables - AllPinouts
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serial

The Hardware Book - HwB

a jumper box will help to find the right pins to connect
if you walk in to a meeting of elderly computer users you might find someone to help with this

so . .
let me/us know how you did please

[rszemeti]

did you make any progress yet ?
this is not really a multicam issue, just a general serial connection thing
which come's in a lot of varieties :-///

Not really, because usually on a standard 9 or 25 pin RS232 interface you know it is going to be one of 2 basic layouts, either DTE or DCE .. and its pretty simple to sort out ( as I have done on tens of older machines in the past) ... There is no published standard for wiring of an RJ45 for RS232, so the links are not really helpful ... and similarly "old computer guys" (of which I am one) would only be able to put a scop on the pins and try and figure it out that way. Easy enough for TX and RX, but a PITA for the handshake lines.

As you may know, Extratech who make nice the controllers used in Multicam machines have a policy of not assisting individual requests for info and simply refer you back to the router manufacturer.

If I can't find someone who can shed any light on it, I'll have to resort to the long a tedious method of "messing around with a scope"

[keesfrees]

I see
will this help you :

[keesfrees]

. .
The machine is older .. so I think it is unlikley it is ethernet ... we have the full wiring diagrams, . . .

my multicam was build almost 20 years ago, with ethernet . . .
and serial connection to, I might still have the cable that came with it

what controller board do you have in it ?
photo ?

[rszemeti]

I see
will this help you :

No, that won't help even a tiny bit.

As should be clear to you by now, I have a in-depth knowledge of standard serial connections, but no information on the RJ45 used on the Extratech controller ...

[rszemeti]

Hi, I don't need the cable, I already have lots of cables ... but, if you still have the machine, a photo of the back of the 25pin plug on the side of the cabinet would be useful, just make sure it is close enough for me to see the wire colors.

[keesfrees]

I'm still trying to understand you're situation

it turns out I have an M24 board (and a spare :-> )
( both to be redundant )
so I can't really speak for an M23 board
I do have the diagrams for the M23, which is very hard to get a full picture of because it's divided in to a lot of -very cryptically- sub-drawings
in "m23_mat.dwf" there is a block in the drawing described as "isolated serial port"
that doesn't help much :-/

there's no DB-25p on my machine's

.. all that is left is a cut cable that goes back to the controller card, where it terminates in an RJ45 . .

the M24 board has ethernet on RJ45 and serial on a flat ribbon-cable connector
what's the wiring on the RJ45 look like ? 4x2 twisted pair

that's prob. all to obvious, sorry . .
are you sure it's not ethernet ?

it would be nice to know what type of IC is connected to the RJ45, look for data-sheet and you know
that would take quite some effort to get to it, because of the stacked boards . . .

when you boot the machine, what does the display tell you about system-software, maybe that 'll give a clue (?)

do you have the motion mechanic software yet ?
and manual (v7.0) .chm or such

I'm sure MCPservice will know about it
he's been a great help to me !
in total contrast to my very ex local dealer :-(((

[rszemeti]

the M24 board has ethernet on RJ45 and serial on a flat ribbon-cable connector
what's the wiring on the RJ45 look like ? 4x2 twisted pair

yes, but, it is not arranged like ethernet, it goes pair, pair, pair, pair across the connector ... ethernet goes pair, +, pair,-,pair

that's prob. all to obvious, sorry . .
are you sure it's not ethernet ?

Not 100% sure, but, the cable is not wired like ethernet, there is a 25 pin hole on the side of the cabinet, when I press the menu sequence on the keypad that the manual says will get to the ethernet settings, nothing happens.

it would be nice to know what type of IC is connected to the RJ45, look for data-sheet and you know
that would take quite some effort to get to it, because of the stacked boards . . .

when you boot the machine, what does the display tell you about system-software, maybe that 'll give a clue (?)

When it boots it says ... "loading 4.34 init"

do you have the motion mechanic software yet ?
and manual (v7.0) .chm or such

Manual, yes, software, yes, I have MX32 and jobserver etc. I used to have a Vytek Rebel 2 which had the same controller board, so i'm familiar with these controllers to an extent.

[MCPservice]

My apologies for replying so late....RSZEMETI...you PM me sorry< i haven't been on much...I hope this diagram helps

Attachment 299412Attachment 299412

[rszemeti]

My apologies for replying so late....RSZEMETI...you PM me sorry< i haven't been on much...I hope this diagram helps

Unforunately, no, not even a little bit.

As mentioned, I don't have a connector on the machine, either 9 pin or 25 pin D type .... just an RJ45 on the control board.

[keesfrees]

Attachment 299456 Attachment 299454
does one of these look familiar ?
these are 2 different boards, the connectors are in a different order
on the first/not connected :
( bottom row )
ethernet, pendant, DB9p on cabinet
the DB9 on the board was extended to a DB9p on the machine (never used it)
on the other/newer board this connector isn't present

[rszemeti]

Attachment 299456 Attachment 299454
does one of these look familiar ?
these are 2 different boards, the connectors are in a different order
on the first/not connected :
( bottom row )
ethernet, pendant, DB9p on cabinet
the DB9 on the board was extended to a DB9p on the machine (never used it)
on the other/newer board this connector isn't present

Yep, left hand picture looks identical .. so it *is* ethernet then! ... interesting.

The cable that was in there was not wired anything like an ethernet cable should be, so we assumed it was a serial connection... I guess we were wrong and the machine was previously wired up by an idiot

OK, we'll get a cable and take it from there, thanks for your help!!

[rszemeti]

I also suspect then I have the wrong manual ..

I have this style of keypad (right hand one) .. older MG style I think it is called:

Attachment 299528

When we did the menu sequence that is supposed to get ethernet params, nothign happened ... so I guess we were trying the wrong buttons for this age of controller ... any clue which manual we need?

[keesfrees]

have you connected
machine <-> computer with cross cable ?
press "arrow up" , then ?

see if you can ping the host IP-adres from you're computer

it's all in the (my) manual
search for "IP" , then "advanced"

[xjdubber]

if nothing else works you can always try contacting extratech ExtraTech Corporation - Motion Control Solutions they build these boards for multicam they are not always helpfull though

[rszemeti]

if nothing else works you can always try contacting extratech ExtraTech Corporation - Motion Control Solutions they build these boards for multicam they are not always helpfull though

I never had much luck with Extratech ... I have a Vytek Rebel2 which uses the same controller, no one at Vytek seemed to know anything about it, nothing, zip, de nada. So I tried Extratech, all I wanted to know was the baud rate and protocol ... and .. nope, not talking to you, go away.

I eventually found a copy of MX32 and got it going ... although I have since stripped the controller off and replaced it with Linux CNC which is WAY more advanced and very smooth.

I am pretty sure we'll get this up and running now, can't be hard!

[rszemeti]

According to the manual to access the ethernet parameters you should:

Press shift key
Press "?"
Press "down arrow" (on the number "2" button) twice ...

When we do this sequences it simply gives help on the down arrow which says "park down" instead of giving info on the ethernet params.

Was there a different manual and/or key sequence for the older "pro" series machines?

[MCPservice]

On the older series machine, you could only check for the IP and subnet in the Jobserver itself. Exactly what are you trying to find out on this controller.

According to the manual to access the ethernet parameters you should:

Press shift key
Press "?"
Press "down arrow" (on the number "2" button) twice ...

When we do this sequences it simply gives help on the down arrow which says "park down" instead of giving info on the ethernet params.

Was there a different manual and/or key sequence for the older "pro" series machines?

[edzel]

how can i manually jog the head of my cnc so i can reposition the carousel tool changer and the head...because it is keep on dropping the tool when the head get the tools?