[nivlek]

jrmach
to answer a few of your questions

I am holding the part horizontal on the bed. It is held one end by a three jaw chuck and a live centre the other.

There are small tabs to hold the piece onto those listed above.

You are correct that the tool is fouling on one end only which is kind of funny.

the below are the screen shots of the setup of the rotary tool setup.

Attachment 260412 Attachment 260414 Attachment 260416 Attachment 260418 Attachment 260420
Attachment 260422

again, I thank all for your help
Kel

[nivlek]

jrmach
to answer a few of your questions

I am holding the part horizontal on the bed. It is held one end by a three jaw chuck and a live centre the other.

There are small tabs to hold the piece onto those listed above.

You are correct that the tool is fouling on one end only which is kind of funny.

the below are the screen shots of the setup of the rotary tool setup.

Attachment 260412 Attachment 260414 Attachment 260416 Attachment 260418 Attachment 260420
Attachment 260422

again, I thank all for your help
Kel

[SBC Cycle]

SBC Cycle
Could you please advise how I can take more material away with the roughing 3mm tool ?

Sorry to be a pain, but I think that it is my ignorance rather than BobCad program.
Kel

No pain friend, I'm diving into the 4th axis Rotary toolpath for the first time myself so I'm learning right along with you

Try setting some roughing passes in the toolpath. Make the "Spacing" no more than 3mm and try at least 2 passes, maybe more, and see if that eliminates the gouging. Yes, it would be really slow at the machine but we can speed things up after we get some gouge free toolpath.

[SBC Cycle]

MMOE
I agree with you about the simulation. I would rather break a fictitious tool on the simulator rather then the real tool.

So where have I gone wrong.

I cannot seem to find a cutting tool at 2mm diameter with 20mm long cutting flute

Kel

Just one more quick thought, you may not necessarily need a full 20mm flute length to eliminate the shank rubbing. If you want to do it in one shot like you already have programmed, you can increase the flute length until you find the longest flute engagement necessary to cut all the remaining material.

Although you do need to increase the protrusion length if you are having a holder collision.

[RAF.]

This may sound a little off or a whole bunch crazy but here it goes:

First does it look like the problem is pretty much contained to vertical moves againt flat side walls? (that grill area looks flat in the
screenshot)

When I was messing around with 4th Axis Standard, the solution in my think was to let X axis be finished in the indexing part of the program. I don't think a solution was ever figured out to keep to tool from plunging at vertical surfaces. (so remove them before rotary may be a solution)
In order to do this the model would have to be scaled up only in Y and Z axis buy what ever finish cuts will be taken off in the Rotary portion of program, and no XYZ Allowance in the Indexing cuts of the program.
That is one of the reason I was very happy to see Nonuniform Scaling added in V27. It also can be done in another program and then brought back into Bob because V25 and V26 didn't have that newly added feature in V27

A simple model can be drawn with a flat wall to run a test on. Then you might add a minor draft or slant to the wall and retest.

(would also help to be able to see the other end in a screenshot, I would assume the 3 jaw chuck end))

Just some thoughts
RAF.

I think this link may help (maybe you have already viewed these threads) this show what problems I was running into with any type of vertical wall cause when using Bobcad 4th Axis Standard

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/bobcad...ol-path-2.html

Another link That I think is excellent (ShortTract did some good work, on his findings on max step down in steps)

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/bobcad...rd-rotary.html

[RAF.]

Its been awhile since I have messed around with forth but from what I can remember the problem is the rapid Z . If doing small multi step you probably won't show the problem but you probably won't get to the bottom of the part either, unless doing multiple rotary setups progressing your way down to the negative Z. From what I remember I could only get so many passes per setup. Lots of work but I think it was possible.


Even with a long flute length it shows a problem in my testing.

screen shot shows even with the long flute it show a gouge to Z- and if much material is left on a side wall (good luck cutter, on begin of Rotary Axis) I'm sure the tool would scream out BACK THE TRUCK UP

Again its been awhile so don't pin me to any of this

Just some thoughts
RAF.

[ShortTrack]

Kel;

Really would help to have a look at your file.
How about a hosting site and a PM to upload location if you cannot compress and upload to this site?
Or, how about sending just the offending portion of the model? Assuming you can get it to simulate the same error shown in your OP.

-STrack

[nivlek]

SBC CYCLE
thank you for the suggestion.
I have tried multiple passes. in two ways as I was not sure what this did

1 rough pass and 2 finishing passes...... still got the red fouling colour
2 rough passes and 1 finishing pass...... still got the red fouling colour

I have also thought of extending the flute length, but I really think that I am stuck with 3-4mm cutting surface or flute length.


RAF
I looked at the additional forum talks that you said to, but I am no closer to resolving it...... again, I am not saying anything bad about BobCad . I just need to understand how to get around this problem.



SHORTTRACK
I would like to upload it to a hosting site.....could you please advise what is a suitable site and I will try it.

Thanks again for everyone's help

Kel

[ShortTrack]

I certainly don't endorse any of these, but I have used Google Drive and Dropbox in the past. Google Drive allows me 15 gigs of space. I know you can share w/ others on Google Drive

BTW, in post #1, is the red fouling colour an initial plunge to the rotary centerline as the simulation starts to execute the first few steps of the rotary code - once the four index steps are complete? Apologies if this has been answered above.

[nivlek]

SHORTTRACK
From where I am now, I cannot get to Google Drive or Dropbox. Would you have any other options but not using google.

Yes, from what I can see it is a plunge towards the centre line and then rotary turns and pulls back. So then you get the fouling on the shank.

Kel

[ShortTrack]

Kel;
Just to be sure I am describing myself well, I have had 4th axis parts where the FIRST few simulation steps in the rotary toolpath took a dive right to the CL of the rotary axis... After that, it worked as expected. Might this be what you are seeing?

I am not familiar w/ other file share sites, sorry.

[nivlek]

SHORTTRACK
Yes , I think that is what its doing and more.

I have finally found out how to upload items to the "cloud" (I think !!)

The following is where my file is called panelvan2.bbcd

https://www31.adrive.com/filemanager?dir=%2F

I hope someone can open it
Its fairly large at 85mb

Thank you again

Kel

[nivlek]

Sorry......
You have to go here first

https://www.adrive.com/login

and create an account

Sorry .....learning all the time

Kel

[RAF.]

I'm not sure but maybe this what you are seeing?
I put a short flute length tool in to show maybe what the problem is.

What I have done on the screen shot that doesn't show the side crashes. I did a YZ upscale and then did the Rotary cuts
with 0 allowance. Still more testing to do.

Just curious, do your problem areas look like they are vertical walls or have very little angle???

If I get time in the morning I'll try to load your file and have a look.

[RAF.]

KEL

Can you attach just the solid even just the front portion? Just the solid should be a small file. We pretty much know what your Rotary settings are from the screen shots. maybe just add some of your indexing cut info. Maybe we would get a good idea of what's happening without the cloud file.

RAF.

[RAF.]

Here are couple of screen shots that show how deg. of wall effects Z plunge. This is cut in one pass.

This is just what I have found from my testing.

May help, maybe not.

RAF.

I have added a couple files, one which shows how I can control tool movement from top to bottom and also with very small step over in crash areas to control Z rapid plunge

Kel: If you don't have to many bad spots it might work just as a quick easy fix to just do another Index and Boundary the bad area and Equidist offset cut to part before Rotary.

[nivlek]

RAF
Thank you again

Is there any chance that you can download my file from ADrive as per above.

this way we can both see what I'm trying to say.

Regards
Kel

[RAF.]

Kel

I think you need to list like your account link and may be permission to view files.

I don't think anybody would know were to look the cloud is huge.

I will read the tutorial as well

[nivlek]

RAF
Could you please follow the following

go to
ADrive | Online Storage, Online Backup, Cloud Storage

then click on "log in" top right corner

the type in
@gmail.com into the email address

then put the following it the password


next screen go to "My Files" and click on it

and then it comes up with the panelvan2.bbcd

hope that helps

thank you again
Kel

[RAF.]

Kel

are you sure I ran a test and I don't think you have to put your email address and password for everybody to see



after opening account I just uploaded a file and then in my file window at the end checked the box and a window poped up and asked if I wanted to share files then it gives a Link to that file. you might want edit what you have posted. I think if that is your account and password the whole word could use it.



All I did was just copy and paste link to an email to myself to test and it opened it fine.