[exfilarms]

I just got word Quality Machine Tool will not be carrying the PM30 in the near future. Does anyone know who sells the 30 class benchtops? I was torn between the G0704 and the PM30MLV and finally made up my mind on the PM30MLV machine for its mild increase in size over the G0704.

If I can't find a 30 class I will go with the G0704, I'm not interested in the RF45 clones even though they are good machines, just too big for what I need.

Any thoughts on the G0759? Is it worth the $500 for the DRO if I'm converting to CNC right away?

THX

Eric

[Fastest1]

Too big of a mill can be dealt with, too small of a mill makes one wish they had a bigger one.

[tmarks11]

Any thoughts on the G0759? Is it worth the $500 for the DRO if I'm converting to CNC right away?

No, the DRO would be redundant once you converted it. You could probably get close to that if you ebay the DRO.

One big disadvantage of the G0759 over the G0704 (besides the $500) is that the G0759 is backordered for several months, IIRC.

[mhessler]

I'm in the same boat, been stalking different hardware for a few years and then when I'm finally in a position to start a project, I'm a few months too late Matt at QMT told me they stopped carrying that model because it's just too close in price to the RF45s, especially in light of the recent upgrades (their new PM25s are now BLDC and belt drive). I completely understand from an economics point of view, but I'm still sad because that machine had better-than-RF45 travels and variable speed out of the box. For hobbyists that work mostly in aluminum or plastics, the lighter weight of the PM30 vs. the RF45s isn't really a negative.

The only other importer I can find online is Busy Bee, their CX601, but they're in Canada. I've enquired about shipping rates and customs duties etc... but I'm not optimistic.

If there are other US importers of 30L machines, I'd love to hear about it!

-Mark

[hoss2006]

The only other importer I can find online is Busy Bee, their CX601, but they're in Canada. I've enquired about shipping rates and customs duties etc... but I'm not optimistic.

If there are other US importers of 30L machines, I'd love to hear about it!

-Mark

Grainger can import one for you but it's the Optimum better quality/more expensive version.
OPTIMUM Gear Head Mill'/'Drill,3 HP - Milling and Drilling Machines - 5TXG1'|'BF30 - Grainger Industrial Supply
Drillspot carries it too for a little less $.
Optimum BF30 Gear Head Mill/Drill, 17 In, VS, 115v, 1.5HP
Hoss

[AVRnj]

Grainger can import one for you but it's the Optimum better quality/more expensive version.
OPTIMUM Gear Head Mill'/'Drill,3 HP - Milling and Drilling Machines - 5TXG1'|'BF30 - Grainger Industrial Supply
Drillspot carries it too for a little less $.
Optimum BF30 Gear Head Mill/Drill, 17 In, VS, 115v, 1.5HP
Hoss

Man, those Optimum's are really expensive. I just don't see the value in that at all. From Grahams build of his BF20 Optimum, it did not seem like the quality was THAT much better than a Weiss, for what seems to be more than double the price

[hoss2006]

I don't set the pricing just showing what's available, the Optimums DO have a better reputation from the years of people talking about them here over the new low priced versions like from PM we have been seeing the past few years.
Hoss

[AVRnj]

I don't set the pricing just showing what's available, the Optimums DO have a better reputation from the years of people talking about them here over the new low priced versions like from PM we have been seeing the past few years.
Hoss

My comments were certainly not directed at you, I realize you were just showing the options since the PM30's are no longer available, I am just commenting on the high price of the Optimums in general.

They definitely look better, and they appear to have higher QA, and warrant a higher price, I just am not convinced it is worth > 2x the cost that they charge. I suppose that is up to the buyer. For some that might be worthwhile. When I looked into the Optimums when I was buying my PM30, I just could not come close to justifying it.

[hoss2006]

I wasn't saying they are worth the extra money either, just giving the info so they can decide how bad they want a bf30.
Import the more affordable model from Canada or the expensive ones here now, personally I'd get an RF45 instead from here for around $2k.
Hoss

[AVRnj]

I wasn't saying they are worth the extra money either, just giving the info so they can decide how bad they want a bf30.
Import the more affordable model from Canada or the expensive ones here now, personally I'd get an RF45 instead from here for around $2k.
Hoss

Understood, certainly was not implying you were claiming it was worth the value, I was really just giving my opinion of the value.

I kind of agree on the RF45 based on what is available now, but I will say I would be concerned with the extra weight and the difficulty it would add to the conversion. Having recently finished converting my PM30, I probably ended up putting the table on and taking it off at least 6 times, between making adjustments, measuring, testing, setting up for the oil lines, etc. That table is big, but I am able to manage it by myself (BARELY). I believe the RF45 tables are almost 2 x as heavy, which would make it a 2 person job, and would add a lot of complexity to the whole conversion. Certainly can be overcome, but an extra thing to have to worry about.

The column and head are much beefier too, but I don't think they are on and off as much as the table may need to be.

But I do agree that if I was buying now, I would likely get an RF45 now as I would be afraid of outgrowing the BF20/25's and I would not be willing to fork over the ~$5k shipped for the BF30 before even considering the conversion costs. You are into Novakon/Tormach territory at that price.

[hoss2006]

Ok, agreed and seeing how neither the op or mhessler I replied to about bf30 US availability want an RF45 the point is moot.
Hoss

[SCzEngrgGroup]

I probably ended up putting the table on and taking it off at least 6 times, between making adjustments, measuring, testing, setting up for the oil lines, etc. That table is big, but I am able to manage it by myself (BARELY). I believe the RF45 tables are almost 2 x as heavy, which would make it a 2 person job, and would add a lot of complexity to the whole conversion.

The trick is to find a way to do it that doesn't require muscle power. I've removed the table from my 9x49 knee mill many times by myself, effortlessly. I have several rolling tool carts. I would extend the table all the way to one side, roll the cart under, then shim under the table with wood blocks and pieces of scrap metal, until the weight was carried by the cart, then simply roll the cart away from the machine. It goes back in just as easily. I've done the same to move my 700# lathe to another bench across the shop, again working by myself.

Regards,
Ray L.

[AVRnj]

The trick is to find a way to do it that doesn't require muscle power. I've removed the table from my 9x49 knee mill many times by myself, effortlessly. I have several rolling tool carts. I would extend the table all the way to one side, roll the cart under, then shim under the table with wood blocks and pieces of scrap metal, until the weight was carried by the cart, then simply roll the cart away from the machine. It goes back in just as easily. I've done the same to move my 700# lathe to another bench across the shop, again working by myself.

Regards,
Ray L.

Makes sense, I think Harbor freight sells something that has a hydraulic lift that would probably work very well for that.

[mhessler]

Grainger can import one for you but it's the Optimum better quality/more expensive version.
Drillspot carries it too for a little less $.

Thanks Hoss, yeah I knew about the Optimum but I completely forgot to mention it above, mostly due to the price. It's like buying a real Rong-Fu machine vs. one of the clones: almost certainly better quality and QA, which is *clearly* reflected in the price.

(...) personally I'd get an RF45 instead from here for around $2k.

With the PM-30MVL no longer available I'm stuck between deciding whether to convert a BF20, or say F it and buy the IH/Charter Oak 12Z as they're not much more expensive than the standard-sized RF45s. I don't need the mass of the bigger machines for the materials I want to cut, but at the same time I'm positive that as soon as I commit to a G0704/PM25 I'll find that I could really use more travel. So I'm fretting over the ~$3K vs. ~$6K said-and-done cost between my two options (converted, belt drive, VFD, etc...)

Le sigh!

Cheers,
-Mark

[cowanrg]

Say F it.

I ended up with the PM30MVL and I kinda wish I had gone with the BF45. The work envelope is great, the power seems good, but I would like the extra rigidity, especially considering the little bit more money. The G0704/BF20 size just seems like it would have been too small.

I've been on this forum for awhile now, and I've NEVER seen someone get too big of a mill. They always complain they went too small. Everyone wishes they could go bigger.