[roy_okc]

After many months of lurking here, planning, scrapping plans, planning some more, seeking advice, purchasing parts, etc., I finally started on my first machine a couple months ago. I chose the basic Solsylva design that has raised side rails, but that's about the only Solsylva design element left. Due to limited space in my workshop, my bed between posts is just over 24" wide, bed length is a bit over 51" and just over 48" between posts; this will give me around 18-19" x 51" capacity. Additionally, I will have the ability to run past the end of the bed by a couple inches to allow cutting endgrain, such as for dovetails or run full sheets through sideways (indexing required obviously). I also plan on bolting on vertical and horizontal rotaries at a later point. I'll probably start out using my Hitachi router for a spindle, but plan on getting a SuperPID and dedicated router (maybe Colt) fairly soon after I get this beast running.

My primary purpose for building this is to decorate various woodworking projects, to include new cabinets throughout the house (hopefully in '12), furniture, kids furniture, toys, gifts, etc. I could also venture into some lost-foam aluminum casting projects with son-in-law. May also see what collaboration I can do with brother-in-law's former girlfriend who is an artist and frequently paints on non-traditional media. I'll be ecstatic if I make any income from this, although I currently have no plans nor expectations of doing so.

Besides wood and other soft materials, I hope this might be strong enough to do some occasional light and slow work in soft metals.

I'm building this using 80/20 15-series purchased from the 80/20 Ebay store, quite a few parts from CNCRouterParts.com, Rollon TLV43 and maybe ULV43 rails and CDW43 190 trucks for X & Y, some 15mm linear rail and trucks for Z. The base area will have storage drawers for bits, tools, and etc. I'm using dual R&P on the long axis, 1/2-10/5-start Acme on gantry, and 1/2-10/1-start on Z axis.

For electricals, I'm leaning heavily towards Ahren's new 5 axis breakout board, G251 drivers, 48v/12.5a power supply, and 380 oz-in Nema23 steppers; I believe this will be cheaper and probably easier in the long run when I add the rotaries compared to starting with a G540.

I'm hoping I can use EMC2, as I'm a long-time Linux guy; prepared to go to Mach if I can't get the quality I'm wanting.

Sorry, I don't have nice 3D renderings, just a basic diagram I did in OpenOffice. The first photo is as it was this morning, the lower framework complete (as it has been for a few weeks--life got in the way of progress). As I'm designing as I go and limited to weekend mornings and early afternoons due to heat, progress will be a bit slow; I hope to have the design finalized and much put together during a very long Independence Day weekend although I'll have to get a few more parts to completely finalize the mechanicals.


More to come...

Roy

[ger21]

If it's not too late, don't use 1 start screws on the Z axis. It'll be too slow and limit your cutting speeds when doing 3D cutting. Go with at least 2 start.

[roy_okc]

Gerry,

Thanks for the advice. I've already purchased 1-start rod and nut for my Z, so I'll probably use that for now and determine what would be better after running for a while.

I've seen many comments about 5-start allowing the router to drop to the bed when the motor is powered off. Would 1/2-8 or -10 2-start not have that problem?

Thanks again,
Roy

[roy_okc]

Made some progress yesterday and today.

Yesterday I temporarily mounted my X rails yesterday, although I haven't cut them to length yet; also mounted Rollon rails to X rails and R&P on one side.

Today I figured out how to attach my Y to my Rollon trucks. I then cut my Y gantry and temporarily mounted it. I now realize that I may have cut it too short, but I'll make it work to get started; luckily the cutoff piece is plenty long if I need to switch it out. I've figured out two possible methods to attach my Y drive to my Z unit, but that's another day.

[LikuiD]

You seem to be making progress pretty fast
If you don't mind, could you always keep us updated with pictures as well? They really help newbies like me

[Mountaincraft]

Gerry,

Thanks for the advice. I've already purchased 1-start rod and nut for my Z, so I'll probably use that for now and determine what would be better after running for a while.

I've seen many comments about 5-start allowing the router to drop to the bed when the motor is powered off. Would 1/2-8 or -10 2-start not have that problem?

Thanks again,
Roy

I use the CNC router parts system with the High Z plate, a 24" 1530 extrusion, 12" of Z travel, NEMA34 stepper, K2CNC router mount and a PC 690 router...

I use a 5 start 1/2" screw and haven't even a 'hint' of the thing gravity feeding down when power is removed... not so far anyways...

[louieatienza]

Gerry,

Thanks for the advice. I've already purchased 1-start rod and nut for my Z, so I'll probably use that for now and determine what would be better after running for a while.

I've seen many comments about 5-start allowing the router to drop to the bed when the motor is powered off. Would 1/2-8 or -10 2-start not have that problem?

Thanks again,
Roy

I use 1/2" 8- 8 start (1tpi effective) and have not yet had my router move when the machine is powered off. I use AB nuts from dumpsterCNC.com which fit nice and snuc to the screw. I have a 2-1/4" Bosch router and my carriage is made of 1" phenolic, with rails made of 3/4" drill rod, so it is quite heavy.

[roy_okc]

@Likuid, sorry about lack of photos. I didn't have my phone/camera out with me while I was working on it before it got too hot to work. I'll take some pictures when I next work on it, probably this weekend.

@Mountaincraft and Louieatienza, thanks for your experiences with multi-start Z rod. MC, are you using the CNCRouterParts nut?

Roy

[roy_okc]

Here are photos of the state where I left off last weekend.

I temporarily attached my 1530 X axis rails, but have not yet cut them down from the original 8'. I also attached a length of Rollon TLV-43 (bought used on Ebay) and gear rack (Moore Gear). I decided to move the Rollon to the side rather than top to hopefully cut down on stuff getting in the rails and also give a bit more Y movement.

I attached a piece of 1530 to each of the trucks, with access holes to reach the 4 bolts (ignore the 2 bolts in picture) on the Rollon truck.

I temporarily attached my 1545 gantry beam to the truck rails. I will have wide gussets on both front and back, 3" tall on one side, 1.5" tall on the other, depending on where the Acme rod ends up.

I realized though, that I need to flip my X 1530 over so that I can get an extra 3" of Y travel. This is where I realized I cut the gantry too short. Luckily, the cutoff piece is long enough, but I'm not going to cut it until I'm positive of my needed length.

Roy

[roy_okc]

July 1, 2011 updates:

I got a few hours of progress in today. Lot of tedious stuff today, drilling a couple holes, tapping several holes, figuring out how to attach stuff, etc.

I didn't have a way to attach the CNCRP pinion assembly to the Rollon trucks in their stock form. To fix that, I drilled a hole and tapped it (3/18-16) between the two end bearing holes. The bolt thread is slightly longer than the depth of the truck, but it doesn't interfere with the bearings.

To attach the pinion assembly tension spring, I drilled a hole through an economy T-nut that goes under the 1530 attached to the X rollons. I'm going to have to shave a bit off the pinion assembly's upper 45 degree corner as it contacts the 1530 long before it reaches the gear rack.

Putting the trucks back together takes some patience. Each bearing is on an eccentric shaft unmarked as to where high or low is and looking at it is not quite obvious. I marked what I thought was the high point on each bearing shaft, aligned all the bottom (denoted with the 'v' on the truck body) bearings so that they all rolled. Then installed the upper bearings and trial and much error got them so they were snug, but not overly tight, in the TLV channel. I can't feel any play with these when they are well adjusted. I did figure out that the end scrapers have a LOT of drag; I'm kind of guessing 2 to 5 pounds. I don't know if it is due to their age or if that is just how they are. I'm going to take them all off for now and when I get the beast moving under its own power test to see if having them on affects speed significantly.

I reattached my too-short gantry, attached a piece of uncut Rollon rail on top and Acme rod bearing blocks on the back. (Yes, I know the Acme nut goes between the bearing blocks, I wanted to be able to access it easy for now.) Not sure if where I'll put the rod, front or back, but I wanted to see a bit of overall progress on the gantry.

That's all for today. Hope to have more progress tomorrow.

Roy

[louieatienza]

July 1, 2011 updates:

I got a few hours of progress in today. Lot of tedious stuff today, drilling a couple holes, tapping several holes, figuring out how to attach stuff, etc.

I didn't have a way to attach the CNCRP pinion assembly to the Rollon trucks in their stock form. To fix that, I drilled a hole and tapped it (3/18-16) between the two end bearing holes. The bolt thread is slightly longer than the depth of the truck, but it doesn't interfere with the bearings.

To attach the pinion assembly tension spring, I drilled a hole through an economy T-nut that goes under the 1530 attached to the X rollons. I'm going to have to shave a bit off the pinion assembly's upper 45 degree corner as it contacts the 1530 long before it reaches the gear rack.

Putting the trucks back together takes some patience. Each bearing is on an eccentric shaft unmarked as to where high or low is and looking at it is not quite obvious. I marked what I thought was the high point on each bearing shaft, aligned all the bottom (denoted with the 'v' on the truck body) bearings so that they all rolled. Then installed the upper bearings and trial and much error got them so they were snug, but not overly tight, in the TLV channel. I can't feel any play with these when they are well adjusted. I did figure out that the end scrapers have a LOT of drag; I'm kind of guessing 2 to 5 pounds. I don't know if it is due to their age or if that is just how they are. I'm going to take them all off for now and when I get the beast moving under its own power test to see if having them on affects speed significantly.

I reattached my too-short gantry, attached a piece of uncut Rollon rail on top and Acme rod bearing blocks on the back. (Yes, I know the Acme nut goes between the bearing blocks, I wanted to be able to access it easy for now.) Not sure if where I'll put the rod, front or back, but I wanted to see a bit of overall progress on the gantry.

That's all for today. Hope to have more progress tomorrow.

Roy

Roy, having used Rollon rails and trucks in my build, I can echo your observations on the sweeps. Removing them is like night and day -they can be made almost frictionless without the sweeps - though you do want something there to keep the rails clean. What I did (on my x axis) was cut them down a tad with a nail file, and wiped them down good to remove any grit. Helped a lot. Judging by the amount of grease on the ones I bought, I don't think these things had a easy life in their previous install. I haven't done so ywt, but hope to make brush sweeps for them in the future.

As for the preload... The first, thid, and fifth bearing are on eccentric adjusters. The second and fourth are stationary. The best way I've found to adjust these is to get bearing 1, 3, and 5 just slightly higher than 2 and 4. Put it into the TLV track, and there should be some play. Adjust 3 till it hits the top channel in the track with a very slight preload. There should be almost no play. Once that is good you can bring bearings 1 and 5 up. I also took a thin crescent wrench and ground it down to fit between truck and rail, this way I can set the preload without removing the truck from the rail.

You could potentially set the three adjustable bearings low, but this will affect where the truck is in relation to the rail, and might cause clearance issues.

[roy_okc]

Roy, having used Rollon rails and trucks in my build, I can echo your observations on the sweeps. Removing them is like night and day -they can be made almost frictionless without the sweeps - though you do want something there to keep the rails clean. What I did (on my x axis) was cut them down a tad with a nail file, and wiped them down good to remove any grit. Helped a lot. Judging by the amount of grease on the ones I bought, I don't think these things had a easy life in their previous install. I haven't done so ywt, but hope to make brush sweeps for them in the future.

As for the preload... The first, thid, and fifth bearing are on eccentric adjusters. The second and fourth are stationary. The best way I've found to adjust these is to get bearing 1, 3, and 5 just slightly higher than 2 and 4. Put it into the TLV track, and there should be some play. Adjust 3 till it hits the top channel in the track with a very slight preload. There should be almost no play. Once that is good you can bring bearings 1 and 5 up. I also took a thin crescent wrench and ground it down to fit between truck and rail, this way I can set the preload without removing the truck from the rail.

You could potentially set the three adjustable bearings low, but this will affect where the truck is in relation to the rail, and might cause clearance issues.

Louie,

Thanks for confirming your experience with the scrapers. Have you noticed any debris accumulating in the rails without the scrapers?

Yes, my trucks were covered with grease in the bearing area. Did you get yours from an Ebay seller in Texas, 41" long?

So far all of the bearings that I've pulled off and looked at have been on eccentric shafts. There is a possibility that I haven't encountered the non-eccentric versions as I may have first taken apart trucks from a couple ULV rails that I initially bought; will definitely look through my loose bearings today. I took the opposite approach to preloading mine, bottoming out 1, 3, and 5, then installing and adjusting 2 and 4; sure doesn't take much to go from too loose to too tight.

I cut out a notch in a piece of thin aluminum for my wrench, however, it is too thick for the TLV and I cut the notch too wide so it tends to spread and slip. I need to take a look in my assortment of cheap metric wrenches to see if I have one that size and grind it down.

Are you using single rail pieces? I'm hoping to be able to butt pieces together and extend past the 41". Alternatively, if that doesn't work well, I may purchase a long piece or two of ULV43 and cut it down. I think the ULV43 would work fine, but really like that the TLV43 truck has no way to move/rotate in its track where the ULV43 can, although with great difficulty.

Thanks,
Roy

[roy_okc]

Saturday, July 2, 2011 progress:

Got some more tedious stuff done today plus a little bit of prepping and thinking for my Z axis, so that's good.

Based on louieatienza's post above, I went ahead and ground down an old 15 mm Western Auto (anybody remember them) wrench to use to adjust my Rollon truck bearings while loaded in the TLV railing. Took quite a bit of time to get it down to the needed thickness.

I also ground off a corner on each of my pinion assemblies so that they fit under the overhanging 1530. Now the pinion gear fully engages on the gear rack and there is still a bit of leftover space.

I cut down the TLV rails for my Y gantry and mounted them with a truck on each.

Now to figure out how I'm going to build my Z axis and connect to my Y Acme rod. (Before anyone calls me out on using 1-start rod on my Y, it is there only for mockup; I'll have 5-start there eventually.) I have an idea, but will probably mock it up in scrap wood first to make sure the concept is sound.

So far, this is going together much easier and quicker than I had anticipated. Normally, the only luck I have is bad luck and everything takes at least twice as long as I estimate. If I can figure out my Z this quickly I'll be ecstatic.

That's all for today.

Roy

[louieatienza]

Louie,

Thanks for confirming your experience with the scrapers. Have you noticed any debris accumulating in the rails without the scrapers?

Yes, my trucks were covered with grease in the bearing area. Did you get yours from an Ebay seller in Texas, 41" long?

So far all of the bearings that I've pulled off and looked at have been on eccentric shafts. There is a possibility that I haven't encountered the non-eccentric versions as I may have first taken apart trucks from a couple ULV rails that I initially bought; will definitely look through my loose bearings today. I took the opposite approach to preloading mine, bottoming out 1, 3, and 5, then installing and adjusting 2 and 4; sure doesn't take much to go from too loose to too tight.

I cut out a notch in a piece of thin aluminum for my wrench, however, it is too thick for the TLV and I cut the notch too wide so it tends to spread and slip. I need to take a look in my assortment of cheap metric wrenches to see if I have one that size and grind it down.

Are you using single rail pieces? I'm hoping to be able to butt pieces together and extend past the 41". Alternatively, if that doesn't work well, I may purchase a long piece or two of ULV43 and cut it down. I think the ULV43 would work fine, but really like that the TLV43 truck has no way to move/rotate in its track where the ULV43 can, although with great difficulty.

Thanks,
Roy

Roy, the best configuration would be a T or TK, and U rail, as the T or TK will constrain the axis, and the U will allow for any misalignment. You can use two T rails but you have to make sure the alignment is dead on. You do not want to use two U rails, as it woudln't constrict side play.

The trucks that come with the U rails are exactly the same, except for the different sweeps. My experience is that the rails will catch dust, so I make sure to use dust collection whenever possible.

According to the Rollon guys, longer lengths can be achieved by butting rails together, though they come in pretty long lengths. You would havev to grind a "ramp" or "bevel" on the tracks to allow the trucks to movev smoothly which is how the factory does it, but I don't know how easy it is to grind the hardened surface. Pretty easy to cut with an abrasive wheel however..

[roy_okc]

Roy, the best configuration would be a T or TK, and U rail, as the T or TK will constrain the axis, and the U will allow for any misalignment. You can use two T rails but you have to make sure the alignment is dead on. You do not want to use two U rails, as it woudln't constrict side play.

The trucks that come with the U rails are exactly the same, except for the different sweeps. My experience is that the rails will catch dust, so I make sure to use dust collection whenever possible.

According to the Rollon guys, longer lengths can be achieved by butting rails together, though they come in pretty long lengths. You would havev to grind a "ramp" or "bevel" on the tracks to allow the trucks to movev smoothly which is how the factory does it, but I don't know how easy it is to grind the hardened surface. Pretty easy to cut with an abrasive wheel however..

So far, with about 50-55" of rail (41" + gantry cutoffs), I'm not experiencing any binding using TLV on both X rails. Also, butting them together, without any effort yet to ensure straightness, seems to work fine. I do have some capability to adjust the rails side-to-side, so should be able to zero them in well enough to use TLV; however, I do have enough ULV should that not work well.

Roy

[roy_okc]

Monday, July 4, 2011 progress:

Didn't have a chance to work on my machine yesterday.

Happy Independence Day!

Another day of good progress, including figuring out how to build my Z axis. I see the end of the mechanical build in site, I estimate that I'll have this phase done by July 17 at the latest and perhaps even this coming weekend.

I will mount ~6" pieces of 1530 to my lower truck and 1545 to my upper truck. The upper and lower pieces will be tied together with some 1575. I'm attaching NB 15 rails to the 1575. To attach my Acme nut to the Z assembly, I'll use a thin piece of 1530 and drill out the holes to accept the 5/16" bolts; this will be attached to one of the pieces of 1575. I'll attach a piece of 6"x12"x3/8" aluminum to the trucks and attach that to my Z rod nut using a similar 1530 spacer.

I would have had both NB rails attached today if I wouldn't have snapped the only drill bit I had of that size.

It looks like I'll have enough 5-start rod left over from my Y rod to use for my Z rod.

Tomorrow morning, I'll run to the local Fastenal store to pick up a couple more drill bits and a few bolts. I'll also order some more parts from Ahren at CNCRP tonight, hopefully I'll get them by Friday.

Should be able to get several hours in tomorrow. I might even be able to get my router plate attached to the trucks and perhaps even attached to the Z nut.

Roy

[roy_okc]

Pictures for July 4. Didn't attach to previous post.

[roy_okc]

I'm seeking opinion on my router mounts. At present, I have no way, at least none that I'm highly confident about, to make router mounts out of aluminum. Would MDF work for a while? If so, would a pair be strong enough to use to slowly cut some 3/4" aluminum when I get the machine running?

My current fallback for aluminum would be to use a woodworking circle cutter in my drill press on a pair of 3" wide pieces clamped side-by-side. I believe the cutter blade would be able to get through the aluminum. However, my concern with this would be the cutter blade catching on the center seam.

Thanks,
Roy

[PaulRowntree]

I'm seeking opinion on my router mounts. At present, I have no way, at least none that I'm highly confident about, to make router mounts out of aluminum. Would MDF work for a while? If so, would a pair be strong enough to use to slowly cut some 3/4" aluminum when I get the machine running?

I cheated by using 2 or 3 hose clamps to secure the router body back against the Z slider, which was a piece of Al channel with a block of MDF in the back to provide a stable seat for the router body. The photos on on the 5th post of my build log. An inside chamfer on the MDF would have been better.

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/cnc_wo...ver_cnc-8.html

Cheers!

[roy_okc]

I cheated by using 2 or 3 hose clamps to secure the router body back against the Z slider, which was a piece of Al channel with a block of MDF in the back to provide a stable seat for the router body. The photos on on the 5th post of my build log. An inside chamfer on the MDF would have been better.

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/cnc_wo...ver_cnc-8.html

Cheers!

Paul,

Thanks for sharing your method. How sturdy is is your router held like this?

Thanks,
Roy