[RMS]

Hi all:

I hope I am posting this in the right area - this forum is huge!

I am new to the diy CNC world. I have also began to design/plan and buy some material already (just some scrap aluminum). But my next purchase soon will be a very important one and that is the stepper motors and the controllers, I am not worried about the power supply I will problably make that myself.

What I would like my router to do is problably the jack of all thing - a bit of this and that (I hope anyways) such as: engraving plastic or thin aluminum, some wood working, sheet aluminum, and some light milling of thicker aluminum as well.

My question finally is (chair) what motors and controllers should I use, or for that matter stay away from?? I would even consider a kit and soldering it myself BUT at the same time I really wan't somthing thats going to work well. I also wan't it to work well with software. Currently I use AutoCAD to draw my geometry but thats where my knowlege of this stuff ends.

Thanks in advance!

[dertsap]

gecko is the best bet , the drivers leave room for expanding to larger motors , where as a lot of the others are limited up to 3 amp , i ran 4 amp motors on the fet3 board from stepper world , though it is an ok driver it is limited because you need power resistors , when i decided to upgrade drivers the pickings were nil in the more cheaper drivers to run them motors , i did endless research looking for an alternative , gecko was the best bet ,and i am very pleased in that decision , they cost a bit more than the other drivers but i highly doubt the other one can stand up to these ,

kits in my opinion are bogus the motors that you get are small or cheaper elsewhere if you search around , i bought a kit from stepper world and though i can t say anything bad about the product or support but if i knew then what i know now i d be 300 bucks richer , trial and error gets expensive
ebay has motors a dime a dozen , the money you save on ebay can go toward buying better drivers

if your anywhere like me you'll always want bigger and faster , a 3 amp driver doesnt leave much if any room to expand ,so i say gecko

[Captain]

Ok
Here goes.
First take a look at Artsoft (Mach 3) http://www.machsupport.com/artsoft/index/index.htm
This software will control your cnc. check out the link's page.
As for a brakeout board try campbell design's http://www.campbelldesigns.com/ and http://www.geckodrive.com/ gecko 202's would be my stepper driver of choice.
As for stepper motors I have found this guy on Ebay, http://www.kelinginc.net/SMotorstock.html they look good.
Bob Campbell also sells some good ones.

Best of luck. :cheers:

[RMS]

Hey dertsap (Jimi Hendrix - awsome guitar player!) Thanks for you'r info I kinda agree with you about the kits. I also noted on one open type driver board I saw you couldn't use 4 wire motors.

Captain: Thanks for the links, though I have been to most of them but I will re-vist Artsoft. Why do you suggest the 202's from Gecko?

Both of you recomended gecko and I am thinking perhapes that is the way to go my question is if I go with them say the 202 will I need one for each motor and If I deside on using two motors for my x-axis, you know the high end design thats out there that uses the twin acme screws on each side of the table to move the gantry as seen here two motors for the x-axis will I need a forth driver??

Also if I use the Gecko 202's will I need any other boards (besides the power source) Lets say for like 4 limit switches??

[ger21]

It's tough to recommend motors for a machine without knowing everything about the machine. Way too many variables involved. You didn't say what size machine, but the miniumum would probably be around 275 oz-in Nema 23's, up to 600+ oz-in Nema 34's. While the smaller motors in this range can usually be driven by a Xylotex or HobbyCNC, the Geckos have the ability to give much better performance by using higher voltage.

Adding a breakout board will make wiring your Geckos and limit switches a lot easier. there are quite a few available.
As mentioned above, www.campbelldesigns.com
www.pmdx.com
www.cnc4pc.com

[Rance]

RMS,

To get an appropriate answer, you havn't asked enough of the right questions or provided enough info. You say you want to cut Alum. which is one good clue but how big of a table do you plan on building? What spindle will you be using (dremel vs. full size[HEAVY] router)? Do you need a FAST machine? Are you rich? As a noob myself still I can't tell you the in/oz motor requirement per table size but others can chime in.

Sure Geckos are the best (if you meet all the criteria like "you are rich", "You don't have the ability to solder one together", etc., etc.). "Best", now there's a relative term. I have nothing against recommending Geckos to someone if they can afford it. They may be way overkill though. Motor size & controller selection should be based on both short-term AND long-term needs. Keep in mind that chances are that you probably will build a second bigger/better machine. Motors & controller should be based on that machine ("IF" you can afford that right now). Hope this helps, and could you provide more info.?

[dertsap]

Ok
http://www.kelinginc.net/SMotorstock.html[/url] they look good..

Best of luck. :cheers:

id stay away from this guys product , i suggest call before you buy , his number is posted on his site , i called then bought elsewhere , the guy doesn t know much about the products he sells , i notice a lot of people post that link and always say they LOOK good ,which means to me nobody is buying them ,
as far as being rich and over kill with gecko drivers that is BS the geckos are a good reliable driver they can go big or small in motor size
you can easily underpower your system and have to buy everything twice

[RMS]

.... You didn't say what size machine, but the miniumum would probably be around 275 oz-in Nema 23's, up to 600+ oz-in Nema 34's. While the smaller motors in this range can usually be driven by a Xylotex or HobbyCNC, the Geckos have the ability to give much better performance by using higher voltage.

Ok, here is some more data:

I am thinking about Nema 23's 200-275 oz-in and the machine is still in the layout phase but the cutting area will be 28"x18" X (8" approx. z-axiz) and It will be made out of aluminum. ....Thanks for the links!

RMS,

What spindle will you be using (dremel vs. full size[HEAVY] router)? Do you need a FAST machine? Are you rich? As a noob myself still I can't tell you the in/oz motor requirement per table size but others can chime in.

.................Motor size & controller selection should be based on both short-term AND long-term needs. Keep in mind that chances are that you probably will build a second bigger/better machine. Motors & controller should be based on that machine ("IF" you can afford that right now). Hope this helps, and could you provide more info.?

I don't need a fast machine but I don't think I wan't one that crawls slow either. I will be using a Bosch Laminate trimmer that I currently own, though I would like to move up to a full size one too. The Geckos problably would give me better re-sale value also.


I am not opposed to a kit or soldering I can handle that, If anyone has had possitive results with one I would like to know, or perhapes what to stay away from. So far it looks like I could go in either direction, but it looks like the Geckos are still looking like the best. Though I would need 4 of the 202 drivers (I think) and thats about $450+ each rated at 7A, 80VDC 10-microstep drive.

-Vs-

The kit at hobbyCNC is $106 but only rated at 42VDC maximum input voltage, 12VDC minimum input voltage. 24VDC Minimum Recommended Voltage. 3.0 Amps Maximum per Phase, 500ma (.5A) minimum. Each axis adjustable throughout this range.

So it looks like the Geckos have 4 times the power so we could say they are a good deal in that sence. ??

anybody?

[dertsap]

i would suggest running a bipolar chopper driver ,you will get more power out of your motors

[Bruggles]

If you are making a table that small there is no sense in using two ballscrews on one axis, the reason that they use the tandom ballscrews is if it is a longer table, and it is racking or doing other things that aren't desirable. As long as your linear bearings are good, dual ballscrews won't even help. in a configuration like shown in the link that you posted, it could simplify things a bit, but as far as I can see that is the only advantage.

[Revtech]

What about this site? http://www.xylotex.com/ they have a few kits and look to be reasonable. 269 oz motors, drivers and power supply for between 345.00 and 420.00.This is where i'm thinking of buying from. Rev.

[RMS]

What about this site? http://www.xylotex.com/ they have a few kits and look to be reasonable. 269 oz motors, drivers and power supply for between 345.00 and 420.00.This is where i'm thinking of buying from. Rev.

I can't say what one might be better as far as xylotex vs. the one at HobbyCNC http://www.hobbycnc.com/4aupc.php

Does anyone know for sure?

I am leaning more to the one at HobbyCNC.

If you are making a table that small there is no sense in using two ballscrews on one axis, the reason that they use the tandom ballscrews is if it is a longer table, and it is racking or doing other things that aren't desirable. As long as your linear bearings are good, dual ballscrews won't even help. in a configuration like shown in the link that you posted, it could simplify things a bit, but as far as I can see that is the only advantage.

On a traveling gantry type machine for there design I think it makes sence to do it the way they did, other wise they would have had to extend it to the under side to use a single ballscrew, or use pullys and such. I think there is more chances for flexing to occure that way.

[Revtech]

The Hobby CNC motors are only 200 oz VS the 269 at http://www.xylotex.com/ They look the same But i would really like to hear some feed back on the 2 setups. If ayone has some info please chime in?!!

[dighsx]

I have the xylotex and I'm currently upgrading to Geckos. I've been happy with my xylotex setup but outgrown it. One thing I will say is that the xylotex controller is limited to 30-35V and if you get the power supply that comes in the kit the most you'll get is 27V. The motors that come with the kit could run at a lot higher voltage than the board can put out so you're top speeds will be limited. Now for your setup this might not be an issue.

All that said I'm happy I bought the xylotex kit. It was for my first cnc machine and it made for an easy setup. And their tech support is first rate.

There's my two cents, spend them as you see fit.

[Revtech]

You talk about volts. Do you get higher speeds of movement with higher volts? If you don't recommend the power supply or driver boards, Do you have a idea for different ones that would work better and still keep the cost similar or with in 100.00 maybe. I'm at the point to buy and just want to make sure I have done my research. I would hate to have buyer’s remorse. I'm building the David Steele plans for the 24 by 36 machine running a trim router. mainly all wood but will be doing some alum. but will cut slow, I Know! LOL! I would like to use this machine to slowly cut the alum. for the next one! I don't even have one done and thinking of the next! Rev.

[dighsx]

I'm not saying you shouldn't get the xylotex, I'm just saying that if you have visions of either the xylotex of the hobbycnc boards driving your machine at some super fast ipm it's not going to happen. I built my first machine (a jgro) last summer and I got the xylotex because I had enough to worry about with building the machine that I didn’t want to have to start an electronics project too. And for the price it seemed like a good deal. I've been very happy my choice. I'm starting to build my second machine and am now ready to move up to something with more power in the controller dept.

So the way I see it it comes down to this: If you want an easy quick way to get the electronics end of your machine going, get the xylotex or hobbycnc kits. I can only speak of the xylotex but it's easy to setup and it'll run your machine just fine. IF you don't mind spending some extra time and money buy the Geckos 202's, some 270oz-400oz NEMA 23 motors, and a 48V power supply. This would be the long-term solution, you could use this on the machine you’re currently building and you could move it to a new machine later. There's more to figure out with this setup but in the end you'll have more room to grow.

But like I said if you just getting into all the cnc stuff and you want to get up and running the xylotex is a good place to start.

[jeffs555]

Do you get higher speeds of movement with higher volts?

The top speed of a stepper is pretty much directly proportional to the supply voltage, ie double the voltage, and you nearly double the speed. Your supply should not be more than about 20 times the rated voltage of your motors or they may overheat.

[phillby]

I bought 3 425 oz inch motors from this site.

http://www.kelinginc.net/SMotorstock.html

I'm happy as a pig in S*1t. see my build log for more.

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showth...4&page=1&pp=15

[RMS]

Ok I found some possitive info on driver boards at two sites really neat stuff:

http://pminmo.com/steve/steves.htm
and here
http://timeguy.com/cradek/cnc

any input about these driver kits?

[wjfiles]

I notice that if you drill down Xylotec site they have a kit with 425oz motors.