[nitewatchman]

I wonder if deodorized kerosene would perhaps solve the issue with the smell.

I have had to go to this in a space heater I use in the basement in really cold weather. While the odor with regular K1 does not bother me, my wife also complains. I switched to the deodorized fuel and she apparently cannot smell it, I certainly can't, but then again I don't smell a lot of things. I bought the fuel at Lowe's.

nitewatchman

[Steve Seebold]

The only problem with kerosene is you have such a fire hazard

[warrenb]

Try PICOCOOL synthetic soluble coolant. It works great in my machines. It coats everything nicely at the end of the day and prevents rust. It smells faintly of coffee and doesn't get any of the Monday morning stink. At least in my shop. One year so far in my machines and no complaints.

[mike sr1]

Nitewatchman,

thanks for the tip, I do like the no water on the table or vise, but there are other problems like attacking the silicone sealer and rubber parts that I use to seal the table shield etc, it also doesnt like my hands after being in it all afternoon, tool changes etc., rubber gloves are an option but working in gloves is not one of my favorite things.


Steve,
I have used stoddard solvent for years on the lathe mixed with cutting oil, never had a fire problem- but I do keep that in mind as it will burn.

The part finishes look better, tapping is OK, but Relton A9 is much better, the heat transfer isnt as good as water based coolant, but so far no smoke just the kerosene smell, better than years ago but not gone ha!

Warren,

I just dont like the water soluble oil on my machined surfaces, it does work well though.

[freeidaho]

I sure hope you guys figure this out. The thought of spraying any of my prized possessions with water is not sitting well with me.

Has anyone tried any additive rust inhibitors in their coolant? I know, that the coolant mix probably has some in it, but from all the posts here and elsewhere, probably not enough.

Thank you,

kr

[mike sr1]

kr,

This is just a "thing" with me, the guys I learned from would not allow coolant on the lathe, so I am partial to the "no water" coolant. Today coolants are much better than years ago but still when the sump needs cleaning its a mess to say the least.

I tried the "burn" test today, it will burn with the torch on it but when it is removed it will go out, it doesnt flash and keep burning like gasoline or some of the lighter solvents.

I have gotten staining and some rust under the vise etc so I was wiping down the table and vise then spraying with wd40 or kerosene corrosion x mixture just as a safeguard.

[Jabs1542]

Where can you buy Picocool? And is 5452 the specific formula you are recommending?

[mike sr1]

I sure hope you guys figure this out. The thought of spraying any of my prized possessions with water is not sitting well with me.

Has anyone tried any additive rust inhibitors in their coolant? I know, that the coolant mix probably has some in it, but from all the posts here and elsewhere, probably not enough.

Thank you,

kr

I have made about 35 parts using the Kerosene coolant, seems to work as well or better than regular coolant. I was concerned about the heat and if it would carry it away fast enough, it seems to do fine.

I may need to mix some oil with it as it does a number on my hands if I am in it for several hours, I am now using rubber gloves.
The smell of it is kind of bad, at least my wife thinks so ha! I can get this for about 2.50 per gallon, the odorless stuff is over 10 dollars/gallon.
Tapping is still much better with the tapping fluid.
It doesnt like vinyl or my rubber edging or anything silicone based, I am working on that.

I have my table shielded and leak proof so that all the chips stay on the table and the coolant goes down the drains back to the sump and not all over the top of the stand, this really helps with evaporation.

I just shut the machine off and leave it sit without concern as to what the coolant is doing under the vise etc., this is just a personal thing with me.
It seems to have no effect on my shower curtain spindle shield.
It does evaporate out of the chips overnight, so far I really like it. If the evaporation isnt too great I may switch to the odorless version to keep peace in the family ha!

I also believe that the sump will stay cleaner as well compared to the water based coolant.

[Beezle]

I sure hope you guys figure this out. The thought of spraying any of my prized possessions with water is not sitting well with me.

Has anyone tried any additive rust inhibitors in their coolant? I know, that the coolant mix probably has some in it, but from all the posts here and elsewhere, probably not enough.

Thank you,

kr

I don't get this. My experience is limited, but I am using mist and flood water based coolant daily and have had no rust, no staining. Nothing. Works great.

[mike sr1]

Whatever works for you, thats the way I look at things.

[MichaelHenry]

Mike - have you checked into the flammability hazard when using kerosene as a coolant? I'm thinking of the concentration in air due to evaporation as well as just splashing a flammable solvent around where sparks may be generated.

Mike

[SCzEngrgGroup]

What would concern me using fluids not intended as machine coolants, is unexpected hazards. An an example, on one of the automotive forums I frequent, we get periodic questions about using pure propylene glycol as coolant, instead of diluting it with water. Seems harmless, right? Except pure propylene glycol is HIGHLY flammable, with a VERY low flash point, and almost any leak in an engine compartment is virtually certain to result in a fire. I would worry the same would be true with things like Kerosene, ATF and other fluids, especially when atomized, which is near impossible to avoid when machining. Never mind the potential health effects of breathing fumes, vapors, etc.

Regards,
Ray L.

[mike sr1]

Mike - have you checked into the flammability hazard when using kerosene as a coolant? I'm thinking of the concentration in air due to evaporation as well as just splashing a flammable solvent around where sparks may be generated.

Mike

Mike,
I am aware of the flamibility, I checked some in a cup and it will burn but as soon as the torch is removed it goes out, it may not if a misting condition occurs though.

I have used oil coolants on the lathe for years without problem.

This procedure isnt written in stone, I just am looking for a way to get around using water based coolants.

[waltpermenter]

Mike,
I am aware of the flamibility, I checked some in a cup and it will burn but as soon as the torch is removed it goes out, it may not if a misting condition occurs though.

I have used oil coolants on the lathe for years without problem.

This procedure isnt written in stone, I just am looking for a way to get around using water based coolants.

thanks for sharing your experience on this.
walt

[MichaelHenry]

I checked some in a cup and it will burn but as soon as the torch is removed it goes out, it may not if a misting condition occurs though.

It was the vapor hazard (from kerosene evaporation) I was thinking about, mostly. If used as flood coolant (mist may be worse) there is a lot of surface area in the chip pan and pooled kerosene there could elevate the atmospheric concentration quite a bit. Maybe it's not a problem at all but it seemed worth mentioning and you might want to research LEL (lower explosive limit) and vapor pressure as a function of temperature.

Mike

[SCzEngrgGroup]

Mike,
I am aware of the flamibility, I checked some in a cup and it will burn but as soon as the torch is removed it goes out

Yeah.... You can also take a closed can of gasoline, open the lid, and toss in a lit match, and it will simply go out, because the fuel/air ratio is TOO high. But that doesn't mean gasoline won't burn or explode under the right conditions. The point is, there is a range of conditions under which it may be safe, and another range under which it may well be extremely dangerous, and vapors and airborne mist are things that would really worry me. One wouldn't normally think of dry sawdust as being explosive, but many people with woodworking shops have learned the hard way that it can be, when flowing through plastic pipes in a dust collection system - static electric charge generated by the airflow through the pipes can, and will. ignite it. It's killed many a woodworker. Explosion and fire hazards are often not at all obvious and intuitive.

Regards,
Ray L.

[mike sr1]

Yes the misting can be an explosive problem thats for sure, I have a soluble oil setup for that although I havent used it in years.

Good point on the wood dust, and static is a real problem there.

If I used coolant every day I dont think it would be much of a problem, my machine may sit for a week or two between coolant uses, and the table cleaning and oiling is a pain as well.

My chips and coolant are contained to the table, rarely do I get any on the top of the stand, this really helps with the evaporation/chip cleanup problem.

[totalhack]

I just wanted to put in my .02 worth. I have had my tormach for a year now and have been struggling with rust spot issues since day one. I don't get to use the mill as often as I would like and I am not a neat freak so I don't clean up the mill table after every run. I was using rustlick synthetic and I would get rust and a sticky blue residue over everything. Another problem I was having with this rustlick is that it did not play well with aluminum. I machine mostly mild steel but my fixtures are 6061 and I was getting nasty galvanic reactions all over my fixtures. I used this up until just recently when I gave koolmist a try because I seen someone on youtube using it and they said they didnt have rust problems, bad idea. Within 2 hours of machining my table was covered in rust spots. I knew it before I tried it but koolmist was junk.

On a tip from a friend who works in a mold making shop he recommended that I use the semi synthetic Castrol Hysol MB10. I have been using it now for the past 2 weeks and so far it has been awesome. My surface finishes are MUCH better than ever before I couldn't believe the the difference and I thought I had decent finishes before. Absolutely zero rust on my parts or the table and no galvanic reactions on my aluminum fixtures. I am definitely glad I switched to a soluble oil coolant compared to the straight synthetic I was using.

[mike sr1]

Keeping the ph in specified range will help with the rust, the staining I havent found anything that will stop that.I was using regular soluble oil (non synthetic) type coolant, this worked much better in my case, the finishes were better and not as much a problem with rust but it did stain if the coolant was left to dry on the table.

[UniqueMachining]

I've been using Blaso Cut 2000 CF for 2 years or so on the advise of a couple of local machine shops.
It's a Swiss lube with very benign properties.
No Rust, No Stains and great finishes.
THE "CF"{chlorine free}, is specifically for aluminum.

I have recently discontinued using a separate tapping lube and it works just fine.

John