[cobrakai]

I am using master chemical trim e206 and while none of the exposed surfaces show a spec of corrosion, the underside of the vise, and table surface had a patina after 3 weeks of sitting there. I think putting down some way oil first will help solve this issue. Also make sure you are running at the higher end of the coolant concentration. Master chemical recommends 3-10% for my coolant, with 7-10% being recommended for longest life and minimal corrosion. I use 7%

[clmenz]

O

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I317 using Tapatalk

[JohnToner]

Well, I may come to regret it, but I ordered some Mobil cutting oil yesterday. Should have it swapped out and running in a few days. I'll report on the smoke and any other issues.

Thanks to all,
John

[mike sr1]

Well, I may come to regret it, but I ordered some Mobil cutting oil yesterday. Should have it swapped out and running in a few days. I'll report on the smoke and any other issues.

Thanks to all,
John

I for one will be very interested in the outcome as well..........

[JohnToner]

Mike,

Been using oil for the past few days and totally satisfied. Draining coolant tank with the water based coolant was a PITA, but doable. I thought I could use the coolant pump to empty the tank, but it leaves several gallons behind. So, I took off the tank's lid (4 sheet metal screws), let the pump drain. I put the tank on my work bench and using the mill's coolant hose (looks exactly like my shower hose), I siphoned most of the coolant out. I cleaned everything reinstalled the tank and its pump, and poured my cutting oil (The Mobil cutting in the Enco flier) and turned on the pump. Very poor flow owing to the oil's much greater viscosity. I reduced the fluid with two gallons of mineral oil oil and much better flow. I will likely make a new pump or consider buying one with more power. The flow is pretty good now, but lacking that high pressure flooding I got from the water soluble oil. But, the jobs I've run so far came out beautiful. Half inch two flute HSS, 4k RPM, F28, 0.100" DOC, 0.500" WOC (slot), climb milling in 6061, two passes for total 0.200" DOC. Beautiful finish, no problems with chips. I still have to try it with 303 and 4140, but so far so good. Also, no smoke, but that may become a problem with steel.

Hope this helps. I'll let you know if I encounter any problems.
John

[mike sr1]

Thanks for the update John..

I am going to thin mine out with mineral spirits (type of paint thinner), I did this on my lathe and it worked OK, pretty much for the same reason in cold weather the oil wouldnt pump very well, hence the thinner. I am going to wait till spring to try it as its really cold here now and I dont want to wash out and clean the tank in this kind of weather.

The only concern I would have is that shower hose and how long it will last running oil thru it. I do use soluble oil in mine and the hose is doing fine so maybe its not a concern.

You will still get the discoloration on the metal surfaces from the cutting oil, my lathe compound is a brownish color from whatever is in the cutting oil, it will come off with Zylol though and some elbow grease. This is buildup from about 30 years of use though...
The finish will be much nicer thats a fact, the soluble oil gives a pretty decent finish as well, the premier 600 synthetic didnt compare finish wise.

The power consumption should go down some as well especially on stainless, I noticed it pulled easier on the lathe with the oil on as versed to dry cutting.

I went to three coolant nozzles on my machine with .109 holes in them to keep the pressure up and not overload my table drains. I havent ran this setup much, but the initial tests look pretty good. My theory is to reduce the volume to raise the pressure to blow the chips out better.

I hope you have a Happy Thanksgiving..........

[JohnToner]

Mike,

To deal with the increased viscosity and subsequent reduction in flow, in addition to reducing the oil with mineral oil. Also a bought a sump pump from Home Depot. Could have gotten a better price online, but at my age even instant gratification isn't soon enough. I'm running a 5/8" hose up to the block on the side of the mill's head. In all I'm getting fairly good coolant flow with two nozzles installed. That 1/2" pipe that came with the Tormach cooling system is a major problem. Its hole looks to be about 3/8" dia. I plan to make a new block with a 5/8" barb for input and three output holes threaded for 1/2" pipe. Anyway, its all working swell, but I do want to really flood things.

[mike sr1]

I am glad to hear its working out for you John, You might try some stoddard solvent to cut it with, I used that on my lathe, the problem with it was it would evaporate out over time. The solvent will lower the viscosity big time!

I also like instant gratification as I will be 75 next September, a few months behind you ha!

I do mostly small stuff, and not much of that lately. Mine is just for hobby use and a learning experience, always was intrigued with cnc. It has been a good retirement project thats for sure..........

[JohnToner]

Understood. I bought my machine also for a retirement hobby, but now I can't afford to retire! Actually, I'm trying to get all the big ticket items before I retire. My department's retirement plan is not that great. At present I have 15 years service but if I were to retire today, my benefit would only be $2,500/month. For medical insurance it pays 4% per year of service, or in my case, 60%. Coverage for wife and I is $1k per month so I'd be stuck for $400.00 monthly. So, I pretty much have to keep my day job,

[mike sr1]

John,
There is a lot of tarnish on those "Golden Years", not nearly so lovely as they lead one to believe ha!
I dont have much of a retirement income either, soc. sec. and a bit of investment income and I get by allright.

The thing that sticks in my mind is those ruined Tee shirts form the oil spatter off the lathe, and if my containment is satisfactory to keep it off the floor etc. There aint but one way to find out and thats to try it right!? I do look forward to no rust,(if thats what I have seen) and better finishes, I think with the Ridgid oil the tapping will be much better too, I am not familiar with what you are using as I havent tried it, but I would think its similar.

The Ridgid oil did have an odor to it but it wasnt objectionable to me.....

[JohnToner]

So true about those "Golden Years." Hopefully you won't have to upgrade your pump. I would've been OK had I not wanted flooding. Definitely do something with the 1/2" nipple inside of the coolant block on the side of the head. It's very restrictive. This was necessary so there would be enough material on the O.D to make the anti-rotation flats. I will be making a new block w/o the 1/2" pipe nipple. I plan to run a 3/4" line from my pump directly into the block, then some tapped holes for 3 or 4 locklines with brass petcocks. The plastic ones don't seem to operate smoothly and when I adjust the flow, the locklines move and I have to reposition them.

[kstrauss]

Yes, the plastic LockLine valves are wretched! Rather than brass petcocks I used ball valves from Home Depot. I think that the SKU is 172264. There are reasonably priced and give very smooth operation with little flow restriction.

[mike sr1]

Yes, the plastic LockLine valves are wretched! Rather than brass petcocks I used ball valves from Home Depot. I think that the SKU is 172264. There are reasonably priced and give very smooth operation with little flow restriction.

I also use the ball valves, they work great compared to the plastic ones.

[JohnToner]

Well, I couldn't pass a 3/4" I.D. tube through the hole in the chip pan that leads to the coolant tank. So I'm stuck running a short length of 5/8" I.D. garden hose from the pump through that hole where it will connect to 1" I.D. tubing then into the the distribution block which will be tapped for 3/8" ball valves and Loc Lines. I'm hoping that I will be able to run a higher concentration of cutting and still maintain flood level flow. Next, I have to do a coolant system upgrade on my 14x40 lathe. I ordered some 3/8" ball valves which should arrive in a few more days. Any ideas for replacing the LocLines? The ones I have separate too easily (I don't know if they are genuine LocLines or cheap ChiCom knock-offs).

[JohnToner]

Well, I now have the 1" tubing running from where my 5/8" garden hose passes through the chip pan, to where it enters the coolant block I made from some scrap 6061. The outlets are two 3/8" and one 1/2" pipe outlets. At this time I only have two Loclines connected but with straight Mobil 766 cutting oil I have copious flow and the stream of coolant has excellent more than enough pressure for good chip removal. My pump is the cheap sump pump (1/6 Hp) from Home Depot. Loosing the restrictive pipe that came with the mill was a big help. If it continues to work well, I'll do something similar to my lathe.

[mike sr1]

Im glad its working out for you John. I am still thinking about it, my new vise has some black spots on it where the chips lay against it overnight, I wasnt very happy about that! I am thinking about some low sulphur diesel, depends on what it smells like. I have a corrosion x and kerosene mix that I spray the table and vise with after use, and the kero smells pretty bad, I think I could tolerate it but I dont think my wife would ha! I am in an attached garage, heat and ac so I cant leave the doors open most of the time.

Using it on the lathe, I didnt get much smoke if the tool was flooded, if it wasnt then it smoked quite a bit, 90 percent of my work was stainless 316, 304, and some 303.

The only real concern I have is how big a mess is it going to make ha! I used kitty litter sprinkled on the floor, after a few days walking around on it the concrete would clean right up, this was on the lathe and it worked really well.

Thanks for the update, keep me posted and good luck.....

[JohnToner]

I use kitty litter myself. I still need to upgrade my enclosure so as to keep the coolant off the floor and myself. The people at WalMart must think I have one huge cat! The kitty litter is cheaper than the "real stuff" and works great. I'll post some photos of my setup if I ever learn how to get them from my cell phone and onto the Forum. The problem it's a smart phone and a dumb owner. BTW, how do you turn your 304? I've done a lot of 303 w/o issues. It seems to like deep aggressive cuts, but have no experience with 304. I've heard it can be problematic.

[mike sr1]

John,
It is tough material to turn, I like to use agressive cuts as 304 316 tend to work harden, I then finish with a file if need be. I also used carbide pretty much exclusively. My work was as a small job shop, non precision work, mainly fittings and adapters for stainless tube which I needed in my welding business.

304 cutting- my experience only

All 304 shafting does not turn the same, this can vary from stick to stick.
Use agressive cuts if possible.
Keeping the material as cold as possible also makes turning easier.
Tools need to be sharp, a dull tool or drill will work harden it.
I usually used the oiler for turning as it kept the heat down.
Dry turning will work and the finish is nice usually, just dont let the material get too hot.
Stainless is a tough material, it is not hard as many think, it only hardens by working it- 300 series

I spent 40 plus years dealing with it, and the 6061 is a piece of cake in comparison ha!
I still do small jobs for the Dairy, usually only small special fittings etc.

I am going to H Depot to look for a check valve for the coolant system, (maybe eliminate the delay)

[JohnToner]

Mike, I'm not using a check valve. The pump has good steady flow within seconds of being activated. I wish I could've used 1" tubing all the way from the pump to the coolant block, but 5/8" I.D. garden hose was all I could get through the hole in the chip pan. Only using approx. 1 ft of the garden hose, the rest is 1" tubing. I'm very pleased with the results.

[mike sr1]

John,
I finally got around to trying kerosene/jp3 for coolant today, it works as well as soluble oil coolant that I had been using as near as I can tell, more time will tell the story, no smoke either. It is also dissolving the silicone sealant I have in strategic places on the machine and a piece of rubber edging, I think I can live with that, the only real problem is the smell of it, doesnt really bother me but it does my wife ha!
The stuff i got was, 2.50 per gallon, it is recycled jp3, doesnt really smell but when cooped up in the garage with it it does have some odor to it.

We had a warm day yesterday so I cleaned out the sump tank, man was that a mess! hopefully it wont get that way with the kerosene.

I had used this mixed with cutting oil on my lathe for years, the only problem was it was a bit messy but worked well.
Hopefully this will solve my crud problems under the vise etc, we shall see......

Tapping isnt as good as I had hoped, it does work, but Relton A9 works much better.

A side note: The cutters seemed to pull easier and the finish is better as well.