[Atomic_Sheep]

Hi guys, electronics is not my strong point so looking for some help.

I've got a 6040 with the blue box which I purchased a while ago but it hasn't worked from day 1 and it's just been sitting there collecting dust. Now I want to hopefully get it to work.

I have read the thread up to page 47 or so but I can't figure out what VFD is, anyone care to fill me in please?

I took a picture of the internals...

1.) My understanding... silver thing on the left is the power supply... what voltage is it? Why is everyone swapping this standard unit for a 48V? I'm guessing it's 24V... saw that number floating around but don't remember whether it was referring to the power supply.

The VFD is the thing that controls the spindle? i.e. that green board with CDC written on it to the right of the power supply?

Gecko G540 replaces the 3 boards that are on their sides at the top and the board that says YOOCNC just above the power supply?

2.) Also I'm trying to figure out the wiring for the Gecko G540 which I purchased today. Does anyone have any info on how to wire them? I haven't been able to find any info so far.

[john-100]

Hi

the ideal power supply voltage for the stepper motor drivers depends on the motors inductance

from the G540 manual -

". The power supply voltage is determined by multiplying the square root of the motor’s inductance by 32, as in the example below for a 2mH rated motor:
32 * (√2) = 45VDC "


since the maximum voltage you can use with the G540 is 50V
a 48V supply will be ideal if your motors inductance is no more than 2.2mH ( 32 x root 2.2 = 47.5 )

if the inductance is more than 2.2mH the maximum speed you can step the motor will be reduce

the power supply part number very often indicates the outout power and voltage
for example mean well NES - 350 - 48 is a 350W @ 48V supply

the green CDC board will be the VFD that controls the spindle motor
the mains transformer on the board looks small so I expect your spindle motor is a low power motor

I expect your VFD is controlled by pulses from the breakout board that has the 25 pin D-type connector that connects to your PC's parallel printerport

since the G540 converts the PC's PWM signal to an analogue 0 to 10V control voltage you will need to replace your existing motor control board


John

[Ron Thompson]

I don't see a VFD in your photo. A VFD is a variable frequency drive, for controlling the speed of a 3 phase electric motor. (Some spindles are 3 phase). Maybe you have a DC spindle? In that case, the board on the lower right is likely the drive.
The Gecko web site has all the documentation, including the wiring diagram for the G540. The G540 can operate on 48VDC, and the reason for upgrading from a lower voltage is to give the drive motors more power.
Yes the silver box is a power supply. It should be marked as to the voltage. If not, use a multimeter across the + and - terminals to read the voltage. Harbor freight has very cheap multimeters.

[john-100]

Hi Atomic_sheep

what wiring information do you need thats not in the G540 manual ?
have a look at this wiring diagram this is from Homann designs :-

Attachment 333846

I have not found any information on the version of the CNC 6040 control you have but
found this from another post :-

Attachment 333856

Attachment 333858

I expect your PWM speed control will be based on this design

John

[snowyskiesau]

+1 for the Homann Designs wiring. Its how I have my G540 wired for my 6040.
Works well.

[Atomic_Sheep]

Sorry guys, have had barely any time to work on the CNC machine, hopefully over the weekend will get more reading done.

Hi

the ideal power supply voltage for the stepper motor drivers depends on the motors inductance

from the G540 manual -

". The power supply voltage is determined by multiplying the square root of the motor’s inductance by 32, as in the example below for a 2mH rated motor:
32 * (√2) = 45VDC "


since the maximum voltage you can use with the G540 is 50V
a 48V supply will be ideal if your motors inductance is no more than 2.2mH ( 32 x root 2.2 = 47.5 )

if the inductance is more than 2.2mH the maximum speed you can step the motor will be reduce

the power supply part number very often indicates the outout power and voltage
for example mean well NES - 350 - 48 is a 350W @ 48V supply

the green CDC board will be the VFD that controls the spindle motor
the mains transformer on the board looks small so I expect your spindle motor is a low power motor

I expect your VFD is controlled by pulses from the breakout board that has the 25 pin D-type connector that connects to your PC's parallel printerport

since the G540 converts the PC's PWM signal to an analogue 0 to 10V control voltage you will need to replace your existing motor control board


John

The phase inductance of my motors appears to be 3.5mH so I sounds like mine will be running at a reduced capacity which is not a big issue as long as the rest of the machine works (fingers crossed there's no mechanical issues with it which I have potentially noticed when running it i.e. the machine jarrs... hopefully this is all electrically related).

Yes my spindle motor I think is a mere 300w.

I will probably use the stock VFD controller as it comes with the blue box, I'll just use shielded cables to run to the spindle.

I don't see a VFD in your photo. A VFD is a variable frequency drive, for controlling the speed of a 3 phase electric motor. (Some spindles are 3 phase). Maybe you have a DC spindle? In that case, the board on the lower right is likely the drive.
The Gecko web site has all the documentation, including the wiring diagram for the G540. The G540 can operate on 48VDC, and the reason for upgrading from a lower voltage is to give the drive motors more power.
Yes the silver box is a power supply. It should be marked as to the voltage. If not, use a multimeter across the + and - terminals to read the voltage. Harbor freight has very cheap multimeters.

Gocha.

Hi Atomic_sheep

what wiring information do you need thats not in the G540 manual ?
have a look at this wiring diagram this is from Homann designs :-

Attachment 333846

I have not found any information on the version of the CNC 6040 control you have but
found this from another post :-

Attachment 333856

Attachment 333858

I expect your PWM speed control will be based on this design

John

I was referring to wiring for the motors. There's 4 different coloured wires but which one is which was a mystery. Homann designs has A A- B B- or something along those lines but the colours are like green yellow etc... so which one is which. But thankfully I found documentation for the NEMA steppers that shows which wire is which so I think I'm all good there.

[Ron Thompson]

On a 4 wire stepper, there are 2 coils. you can find out which by using an ohmmeter. If two wires have a low resistance to each other, they are a coil. a or b doesn't really matter, just wire each coil to the same letter. If you get it backwards, the motor will turn opposite of what is intended. No big deal, just reverse it in the software.

[Atomic_Sheep]

1.) Well finally got everything to work... now I'm setting up Mach3 and was hoping you could help me out with the ballscrew dimensions. The spec sheet suggests it's 1605 i.e. 16mm diameter and 5mm pitch. However if I measure 20 threads with a caliper crest to crest, I get 4.74mm or something in that ballpark so that's quite a lot different to what the spec sheet says (initially I thought the screw was imperial since this is pretty close to 3/16"). Can anyone confirm that these 1605 screws are in fact 16mm in diameter and 5mm pitch i.e. that the info I found is correct?

I'm doing all the calculations in the Mach3 manual even though I know there is an option in the software where you can automatically set this up, but I don't have any guage blocks at the moment or a DTI so I can't set this up totally accurately using this method. Previously I set this up using a basic steel ruler, but my parts were out, so I definitely did something wrong somewhere and want to try doing it the mathsy way as outlined int he Mach3 manual.

2.) The other thing I wanted to confirm, the Gecko G540 has 10 microsteps? So there's 2000 pulses per revolution of the motor? I've got 1.8 degree steppers.

[snowyskiesau]

1.) Well finally got everything to work... now I'm setting up Mach3 and was hoping you could help me out with the ballscrew dimensions. The spec sheet suggests it's 1605 i.e. 16mm diameter and 5mm pitch. However if I measure 20 threads with a caliper crest to crest, I get 4.74mm or something in that ballpark so that's quite a lot different to what the spec sheet says (initially I thought the screw was imperial since this is pretty close to 3/16"). Can anyone confirm that these 1605 screws are in fact 16mm in diameter and 5mm pitch i.e. that the info I found is correct?

Correct, 16mm diameter with a 5mm pitch - at least on my 6040.

2.) The other thing I wanted to confirm, the Gecko G540 has 10 microsteps? So there's 2000 pulses per revolution of the motor? I've got 1.8 degree steppers.

Correct.

[Ron Thompson]

1.) Well finally got everything to work... now I'm setting up Mach3 and was hoping you could help me out with the ballscrew dimensions. The spec sheet suggests it's 1605 i.e. 16mm diameter and 5mm pitch. However if I measure 20 threads with a caliper crest to crest, I get 4.74mm or something in that ballpark so that's quite a lot different to what the spec sheet says (initially I thought the screw was imperial since this is pretty close to 3/16"). Can anyone confirm that these 1605 screws are in fact 16mm in diameter and 5mm pitch i.e. that the info I found is correct?

I'm doing all the calculations in the Mach3 manual even though I know there is an option in the software where you can automatically set this up, but I don't have any guage blocks at the moment or a DTI so I can't set this up totally accurately using this method. Previously I set this up using a basic steel ruler, but my parts were out, so I definitely did something wrong somewhere and want to try doing it the mathsy way as outlined int he Mach3 manual.

2.) The other thing I wanted to confirm, the Gecko G540 has 10 microsteps? So there's 2000 pulses per revolution of the motor? I've got 1.8 degree steppers.

1) Doesn't really matter, but 5mm pitch is 5mm thread to thread, not the same thing as 5 threads per inch. Doesn't matter because you will fine tune the steps per inch with actual movement measurements later.
2) Yes, 200 motor steps X 10 micro steps is 2000 pulses per rev.

[Atomic_Sheep]

Thanks guys... two more questions:

1.) How do you lube your axes? Any recommended methods/lubes?

2.) What motor speed have you got your machines set to? The max is 3750mm per minute, however in the Mach3 manual it says that it doesn't mean you'll be able to set this speed... so I've so far cranked it up to 3000 and it all seems fine at that speed...

[Adverse Effects]

why not just use the auto tune to set the steps?
Attachment 336570

then just do what it askes

[Adverse Effects]

Thanks guys... two more questions:

1.) How do you lube your axes? Any recommended methods/lubes?

2.) What motor speed have you got your machines set to? The max is 3750mm per minute, however in the Mach3 manual it says that it doesn't mean you'll be able to set this speed... so I've so far cranked it up to 3000 and it all seems fine at that speed...

1:- i dont that way junk wont stick to them

2:- make a test Patten (like a big square and a circle in side of it and make it at lest 2/3 the size of your work area) then run it (in the air not cutting anything) and play with your feed rate and acceleration rate if it makes a horrible noise then turn it down

once you have it working nice and smooth turn all the settings down 10% and you should be all good but you should be good with the G-540 you wont get the full speed out of it but as you can see in my vid its set to 3750 but i am only getting to 2500

[Atomic_Sheep]

Another question... why are my steppers buzzing when idling since upgrading to Gecko? I remember they were completely silent when they were running under YooCNC?

why not just use the auto tune to set the steps?
Attachment 336570

then just do what it askes

I don't have an accurate way of measuring distance moved apart from a long steel ruler.

1:- i dont that way junk wont stick to them

2:- make a test Patten (like a big square and a circle in side of it and make it at lest 2/3 the size of your work area) then run it (in the air not cutting anything) and play with your feed rate and acceleration rate if it makes a horrible noise then turn it down

once you have it working nice and smooth turn all the settings down 10% and you should be all good but you should be good with the G-540 you wont get the full speed out of it but as you can see in my vid its set to 3750 but i am only getting to 2500

I found out that a flexible CNC coupling has a recommended feedrate of below 1500mm/min so I just set my X and Y axis to 1400 and Z to 700.

[A_Camera]

1.) Well finally got everything to work... now I'm setting up Mach3 and was hoping you could help me out with the ballscrew dimensions. The spec sheet suggests it's 1605 i.e. 16mm diameter and 5mm pitch. However if I measure 20 threads with a caliper crest to crest, I get 4.74mm or something in that ballpark so that's quite a lot different to what the spec sheet says (initially I thought the screw was imperial since this is pretty close to 3/16"). Can anyone confirm that these 1605 screws are in fact 16mm in diameter and 5mm pitch i.e. that the info I found is correct?

Measure the real travel. It is better than measuring the thread pitch.

I'm doing all the calculations in the Mach3 manual even though I know there is an option in the software where you can automatically set this up, but I don't have any guage blocks at the moment or a DTI so I can't set this up totally accurately using this method. Previously I set this up using a basic steel ruler, but my parts were out, so I definitely did something wrong somewhere and want to try doing it the mathsy way as outlined int he Mach3 manual.

2.) The other thing I wanted to confirm, the Gecko G540 has 10 microsteps? So there's 2000 pulses per revolution of the motor? I've got 1.8 degree steppers.

Remember that that is not what you put in the "Steps per" field, there you need to put in the steps per unit used, so in my case the number of steps it takes to travel one mm.

[A_Camera]

Another question... why are my steppers buzzing when idling since upgrading to Gecko? I remember they were completely silent when they were running under YooCNC?



I don't have an accurate way of measuring distance moved apart from a long steel ruler.



I found out that a flexible CNC coupling has a recommended feedrate of below 1500mm/min so I just set my X and Y axis to 1400 and Z to 700.

I haven't seen the specs, but that was my experience as well. After replacing the flexible couplings to lovejoy type I could increase the speed and got better accuracy as well, so if you have any speed or accuracy issues... it's money well spent, but may require some extra alignment work because they demand better screw/motor alignment than the flexible ones.

[Adverse Effects]

Another question... why are my steppers buzzing when idling since upgrading to Gecko? I remember they were completely silent when they were running under YooCNC?

1 of 2 things i am guessing

1:- there are trim pots on the G-540 for each channel

2:- you put in to bigger limiting resistors in the cables for the steppers

I don't have an accurate way of measuring distance moved apart from a long steel ruler.

if you can measure with an accuracy of 1/10 of a mm over a distance of 300mm is close enough for us laymen :-)

move the head to one end of the bead
put a ruler against the bit
put something at the other end of the ruler next to one of the marks (say the 300mm mark)
use the "auto tune" and tell it to move 100mm and it will push the ruler along with it
look at what is moved and tell mach3 how much (this time its just to get close so you dont crash the head)
now reset it all and do it again at the longest travel ether the ruler or the bed of the CNC will let you
this way any inaccuracy (like 1/10th of a mm) will be over say 500mm so it will be almost nothing

now you can copy the settings to all 3 axis's if the all have the same ball-screws

[Ron Thompson]

Or you could buy a cheap dial indicator.

[Atomic_Sheep]

Measuring actual movement is on my agenda, but if I can get away with just using specs then even better... I'll do some test shapes to see how close I am.

1 of 2 things i am guessing

1:- there are trim pots on the G-540 for each channel

They did nothing for me.

2:- you put in to bigger limiting resistors in the cables for the steppers

I put 3kohm resistors as per Gecko G540 manual formulas.

[Atomic_Sheep]

Very strange but it seems all my axis are quite different in terms of tuning... I created a cut 10cm x 4cm and for some reason my X axis moved 101.88mm my y axis moved 42mm my Z appears to be pretty much dead on with the setting of 5mm axis pitch... more testing to come. Very strange.