[GPDC]

So, I've now, by long process of elimination,I've decided to go with either
the TM-1P, or the larger -2P....
Anyway....a couple of questions for anyone with the knowledge and who might care to respond & I thank you in advance....
The "Options", "Control Options" & Accesories are what's got me thinking...
Coming from the Mach3 (DIY) world, I've gotta ask, do I really need to spend $1800 on a "programable coolant nozzle"...seems as if that should be a simple "M" driven external relay...is it?.....does that external relay (that I'll use) need the "Cable Assembly for M Code/Haas CNC Control" ?
Does the "Coolant Pump Kit" they supply w/the -1P turn on and off with an "M" code?
Is the 4 th axis retrofitable for when I will need it?...or must I order the machine with it installed?
Is the "CT-40 Tool Package" they offer worth it?...extra pull studs required?
"6-Month Extended Warranty"....I'm inclined to stay away from these
things in favor of buying brand name from the git-go.
Most likely headed toward DNC, so maybe that exempts the "Expanded
Memory to 16 mg" option?....or is that the only way I get the USB port?
Is the "Early Power Failure Detection Module" worth $600...how 'bout just
a good ups?
"High Speed Machining w/Look Ahead"....is useful for what?
Can somebody give me an idea (other that internally broaching (2)
keyways @ angles to each other) what to use "Spindle Orientation"
for...OR....and this is a biggie...is that required to complement the "Rigid
Tapping" option, which (I'm thinking) is the very necesary thing that I
must buy into if I need to make 1/4 npt's, which i do.
Again, thank you guys for any & all thoughts about
anything I've mentioned above....GPDC

[HelicopterJohn]

Hi GPDC,

I am a retired guy and I purchased a HAAS TM-1P 2007 model delivered in January 2008.

I will give you my take on some of the options and I am sure others will also offer you some valuable information.

The TM-1P has 12" Y and 30" X" and I think 16" Z but am not sure. I believe the TM-2P has a larger axis movement, so it would depend on the size of parts you want to machine on which model you decide on. The TM-1P does have windows in the end of the machine that could possibly allow you to machine some larger parts if left open and the part would clear the window opening which is not the total front to back of the cabinet measurement. If you are a little bit creative and want to work with a little bit larger parts and can locate them on a fixture you can do multiple programs to cut a top/ bottom or left/right side of the part as long as you have the proper door clearance.

Yes, the coolant pump is controlled by M codes. M08 turns on the coolant and M09 turns off the coolant. Make sure you get the 3/4 HP High Output coolant pump as the smaller one is a JOKE! The PCOOL (Programmable Coolant Nozzle) is an option that I purchased that I use all the time. If you check the gallery in my website you will see some of the modifications I have made to the Programmable coolant system. The programmable coolant nozzle option will allow you to set the coolant spigot at a different setting for each tool in the tool changer.

I ordered the CAT40 spindle for my machine and associated CAT40 tool changer. I believe that I was told when I ordered it that some individuals had older machines that utilized the BT40 system could order that spindle and associated tool changer. The reasoning behind that was that they could use their old BT40 Tooling. It is my understanding that most of the new HAAS TM-1P machines that are sold today is shipped with the CAT40 as it is the newer tooling standard. Others may be be better qualified to tell you more or correct me if I am wrong. When I purchased my machine the HFO had an offer for a Technicks tooling package which I purchased. That was good tooling but I ended up with a few pieces in that package that I never used. If I were doing it again I would purchase my tooling from Maritool. And yes, you have to purchase a pull stud for each tool holder as the tool holders don't come with them.

If you anticipate doing 4th Axis work I would pay to have the option installed at the time of machine build. If not, you will have to pay your HFO for a technician to come out and install it. I think they quoted me about $400.00 extra for the installation labor. Then you still have to purchase your rotary devise (5K Plus depending of which devise you need) and if you use CAD/CAM Software also possibly purchase an additional module to drive it.

My HFO let me decide within the first 6 month warranty period supplied with the machine if I wanted an additional 6 month coverage. I purchased the coverage but never called them so, for me, it was a waste of money. For others I am sure it could have easily paid off in a BIG way.

You HAAS should come with a USB port and 1 Meg of Memory. I use ONECNC CAD/CAM for most of my projects and so far the 1 Meg of Memory has done fine for me. Ask your HFO about purchasing the 16 Meg option. I think it is a simple activation code you purchase to turn it on so it should cost the same weather you purchase it with the machine or later. Now if HAAS were giving you a BIG discount on the machine and selection options now may be the time to consider that option. I would think you would have to be doing some complex 3D parts to need that option. I am sure others can give you better guidance.

Don't purchase the halogen work light as it was another JOKE for the price.

I didn't purchase the "Early Power Failure Detection Module" or the "High Speed Machining w/Look Ahead" so others will have to offer their opinions on those options.

On the TM-1P that I purchased HAAS installed in the control a trial period for some of the options like Rigid Tapping. I think it was 100 hours. The rigid tapping is like the extended memory option and is a code that is purchased and that activates the option. Rigid tapping was a must for me and is an option I use on a regular basis. One the ONECNC software one of the guys developed an add on that allows for Rigid Peck Tapping at either 1 level, 2nd level or full depth with is nice for deeper holes.

I know you didn't ask but I thought I would add a couple of items that I got with my machine.

I would also get the Chip Conveyor if it is not already on your list of options. It helps with the chip removal and allows the coolant to circulate to the coolant tank easier so you don't run out of coolant.

The most used option that I purchased was the (Renishaw) Wireless Probe and Tool Setter. This option came with both Macros and Scaling at the time I purchased my machine at an approximate cost of 5K. If you look at the individual costs of the Macros and Scaling options the Renishaw Wireless Probe and Tool Setter was around $1500.00. This is by far the most used option I purchased and would do it again without hesitation. I also have a few videos in the gallery of my website showing a few of the macros for probing and tool setting operations.

I know this was a lot of information. I wish someone had given this to me when I was in the purchasing mode.

[HelicopterJohn]

Hi GPDC,

You may want to visit the HAAS Website. The have a lot of information in their training section.

Here is a link to the PDF manual download.

http://www.haascnc.com/custserv_upda...erator_manuals

[CJennings]

Dear GDCP;

I have been running HAAS equipment for 5 years now and I have some useful information for you. My experience is in the manufacturing field.

The programmable coolant nozzle is helpful with large diameter tooling. Most of the coolant lines on these machines can be adapted for more lines. Even valves for better flow.

Not sure about the pump, all my machines are always controlled with m code or manually thru the controler. Depending on how often you will use the fourth axis would determine if you need the retrofit. It may be cheaper to far out the work, but the challange is fun! If this machine is being used 40 hrs a week, I would STRONGLY advise the extended warranty. If not then you'll be fine without. CT-40 Has been the standard for the machines I have been using. (VF-4, VF-2)
lots of options for this size tool holder, but if it is new to your shop expect to purchase more holders and retention knobs. How often does the power go out in your shop? How much is the average cost of your parts? Is it worth the savings to not invest $600 and possibly scrap your work? High Speed Machining Look Ahead is for many MANY blocks of code that require lots of velocity and direction changes coupled with a high feedrate for the application. Older machines tend to hesitate at direction changes, causing your tool to rub for an instant which can add up fast. Look Ahead means the machine is reading ahead in the code and prepping for next line or lines. It improves the quality of part and tool life when machining at a high feedrate. (80+ IPM) Really useful for high production quantities. If you are going to broach stuff then get the spindle orient. It is not neccesary for rigid tapping. And trust me, get the rigid tapping. Chip Augers help with high volume scrap in a short amount of time. Also makes the machine very desireable for resale.
For a guy in his home this could be a hard pill to swallow, but for industrial use I wouldn't skimp on any of this. (maybe the prog. coolant nozzle) And please, buy a HAAS machine. It is sooo easy to use, excellent quality with excellent support.

[hercules]

I bought my TM-1 right about the time Heli John bought his. Mine was delivered in Feb of 2008.

I agree that rigid tap is something that you definitely want. It is used all the time on my mill. I hardly ever use any of the intuitive or conversational programming stuff on the mill (I use it alll the time on the TL lathe), but it was included for free on the TM series when I bought mine so it is Ok for a simple bolt circle or such on occasion. I bought the expanded memory after delivery of the machine because I was doing 3D surfacing and some of the files were big. John is right, to activate the memory you just enter a code that they give you after you pay up. But these new machines all come standard with the USB port now and I realized later than I could just run large programs directly off of the USB so I probably didn't need the extra memory. Since I have it I still use it. To save money I didn't get the wiring for the 4th axis but my HFO tells me it can be added with a 2 hour service call. When I decide to upgrade I am going to try adding it myself first, then get the service guy out if need be because just to get to me is 2 hours of travel time each way for the HFO so it gets expensive just for them to show up. If I was buying again today I would get it with the 4th axis wiring installed. I got all the guards for the ways and I think that was a very good investment. I got the small coolant system and it works good for flood cooling with a couple of hoses added. The downside is that it doesn't have much pressure so if you are machining a real deep pocket it doesn't blast the chips out of the hole and you end up recutting chips which is hard on the finish and the end mills. So I have rigged up an air blast to do that now. Also the tank is pretty small (5 gal) so if the return plugs up you can cavite the pump before too long. I extended the tank. Like you I couldn't see what I would use the spindle orientation for other than broaching ... and I didn't want to risk brinelling the spindle bearings doing that ... so I didn't get it. I also did not get the probe. I would have liked to have it but for the extra $5,000 I just couldn't go there back then. Setting the tools by hand isn't too bad and I just use and edge finder for bores, edges etc. I don't do volume production work though so the little extra time is OK for me. I bought a box of 24 pull studs with the machine because I read some horror stories about bad quality pull studs. I bought tool holders and tooling elsewhere, The Haas price was just too high. Mari Tool has been a good supplier although I am seeing some fretting on one of their toolholders after a year's use. Glacern toolholders seem to me to be lower quality and showed fretting on the taper after less than 10 hours of use. Unfortunately that is on a holder with an integral drill chuck so it was expensive. Others report good luck with them though and there is a whole separate debate about over or under tightening pull studs, cleaning the taper etc that you can read on here. Kennametal had a special going on cat 40 holders a while back and those holders are really nice and show no wear after lots and lots of use. Check their web site for deals once in a while. On special the toolholders weren't much more $$$ than the other guys. They also had several offers over the last 18 months where you buy two boxes of inserts and you get the tool for free so I got two very nice quality insert end mills and a face mill that way for a decent price. As far as power failure options go I did not get the option. I have had the power go out twice while the machine was running parts and it did not ruin the part or end mill either time. Both times it was roughing when the power dropped off.

I love my TM-1. It just runs and runs and for the prototyping and small part runs that I do it has really been a great machine. I think you will be very happy with your purchase.

[GPDC]

Guys,
Collectively, you've given me more of the practical "do this, don't do that" knowledge than I'd get on my own in months & I THANK YOU !......maybe, just maybe I'll be able to offer something of my own to the subject before too long.....!
GPDC