[stevespo]

So, maybe I wasn't crazy back in July?

"When I set coil 0002h=1 (FW) using the ModBus Test dialog, it spins CCW"

You're seeing the same behavior when using the Test dialog? That seems to rule out the Brain as being the culprit and (to me) indicates that it's something with the way the Hitachi ModBus is configured.

Several people seem to have it working, but I wonder how the configurations might be different. I never did get any screen shots or additional information from other users.

I will try and wrap my head around it again when I'm home and see if I can't jog my memory. What version of Mach are you running?

Steve

[BloomingtonMike]

OK - So I enabled PWM on ports and pins spindle control. That seems to allow me to stop and start correct. I flipped two wires on the VFD so now rotation is correct.


I need to know how to set a delay so the spindle comes up to speed before it starts cutting - Anyone know that off the top of their head by chance?


I also need to research how to spin the spindle CCW and check that to see if that works.

The CW button just stops and starts the spindle.

I would be real interested to find out why this happens??!!


I use the mach blue bigtex screen. Not sure of version in the shop but it is at least Version R3.042.040.


Mikie

[stevespo]

Don't give up on Modbus yet!

Ports and Pins -> Spindle Setup -> General Parameters -> CW Delay Spin Up (etc) I'm in Mach right now, this is not off the top of my head.

Been playing around with the Modbus test and I have a new theory. I think the manual is wrong, and that the brain has been coded incorrectly, and people have rewired their spindles to workaround the problem - rather than fixing it! Path of least resistance.

Evidence: page B-19 ModBus Data Listing, shows coil 002h with write values of 0=RV, and 1=FW. Status coil 00Fh shows the opposite, 0=FW and 1=RV. EVERYWHERE in the X200 manual FW=0 and RV=1. The one exception is 002h on page B-19.

So, entering values into coil (001h=1, 002h=0) the spindle turns on and spins FW/CW. I check the status of (00Eh=1, 00Fh=0) as expected. The spindle is moving FW/CW and the status is definitely 0, which is also FW.

I enter values into coils (001h=1, 002h=1) and the spindle turns on and spins RV/CCW. I check the status and sure enough, it is (1, 1). RV/CCW = 1. The Hitachi thinks it is spinning in reverse, and it IS spinning in reverse.

I think the fix is to modify the Brain to send 002h=0 for FW and 002h=1 for reverse. I have played a bit with the Brain Editor and it's hard to make any sense of it (and I write software for a living!). I will take another stab at it when I have the energy.

EDIT: The other typo on the page is "enable when A003=03", when it should be "enable when A002=03". A003 controls the "base frequency setting" and A002 controls "set run FW command source".

Steve

[BloomingtonMike]

I made a video of my modbus bench test tonight prior to breaking down and running the new wire and mounting the spindle. Check it out if you want.

Bench test of Modbus controlled Hitachi X200 VFD and 2.2kw Chinese Spindle - YouTube

I got the spindle startup delay set too - ports and pins, spindle control is where you set it. Works great.

[BloomingtonMike]

.... and here is the setup installed video. Thanks SOOO much to everyone in this thread and on the machsupport thread.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x24rP5n0RNw]Modbus controlled Hitachi X200 VFD, 2.2kw 3Hp Chinese Spindle, Spindle Water Cooling all installed! - YouTube[/ame]

[vid1900]

Don't give up on Modbus yet!

Ports and Pins -> Spindle Setup -> General Parameters -> CW Delay Spin Up (etc) I'm in Mach right now, this is not off the top of my head.

Been playing around with the Modbus test and I have a new theory. I think the manual is wrong, and that the brain has been coded incorrectly, and people have rewired their spindles to workaround the problem - rather than fixing it! Path of least resistance.

Evidence: page B-19 ModBus Data Listing, shows coil 002h with write values of 0=RV, and 1=FW. Status coil 00Fh shows the opposite, 0=FW and 1=RV. EVERYWHERE in the X200 manual FW=0 and RV=1. The one exception is 002h on page B-19.

So, entering values into coil (001h=1, 002h=0) the spindle turns on and spins FW/CW. I check the status of (00Eh=1, 00Fh=0) as expected. The spindle is moving FW/CW and the status is definitely 0, which is also FW.

I enter values into coils (001h=1, 002h=1) and the spindle turns on and spins RV/CCW. I check the status and sure enough, it is (1, 1). RV/CCW = 1. The Hitachi thinks it is spinning in reverse, and it IS spinning in reverse.

I think the fix is to modify the Brain to send 002h=0 for FW and 002h=1 for reverse. I have played a bit with the Brain Editor and it's hard to make any sense of it (and I write software for a living!). I will take another stab at it when I have the energy.

EDIT: The other typo on the page is "enable when A003=03", when it should be "enable when A002=03". A003 controls the "base frequency setting" and A002 controls "set run FW command source".

Steve

Steve,

So what finally happened with the fw/rev ?

Did someone finally edit the brain?

[stevespo]

I just haven't had the time to look at it. I will eventually get around to it, but it's a very low priority right now.

I have a workaround by using the VFD programmable input to control on/off and direction. I'm just using MODBUS to control the speed. I was hoping that one of the Brain authors would just make the fix, but I guess they're not watching these threads anymore.

Steve

[henrikm]

I have just set up my X200 with modbus and have it running, but also have the same problem as everyone else, being that it runs CCW. Been using it for a while manually and it has been running correctly CW.

Did anyone figure out the settings/brain to have it run CW?

Edit: Never mind, figured out how to rewrite the brain to run the spindle correctly

[diyengineer]

.... and here is the setup installed video. Thanks SOOO much to everyone in this thread and on the machsupport thread.

Modbus controlled Hitachi X200 VFD, 2.2kw 3Hp Chinese Spindle, Spindle Water Cooling all installed! - YouTube

Clean setup, i like it!

[allengambrell]

I just got my spindle and x200 setup today and have a couple of questions.

I used the settings from the first page of the thread and it seems to be working fine. But I was wondering if I could get the display to show the rpms instead of the frenquency. I am going to try modbus, but in the meantime I would love to see the speed instead of the freaquency.

Also I saw something in the settings for the number of poles. Does this have anything to do with the number of wires, my spindle has 3 plus ground. The only choices are 2 pole and 4 pole, I do not see a 3 pole?

Also I am running 220v to it, so do i need to set A082 to 220v?

Here are the settings I used in the x200

X200 settings:
A001: 00
A002: 02
A003: 400Hz
A004: 400Hz
A061 400
A062 200
A082: 230V
A151 200
A152 400
A153 0
A154 100
A155 00

B012: 10

H003: 2.2KW
H004: 2 poles

[diyengineer]

I just got my spindle and x200 setup today and have a couple of questions.

I used the settings from the first page of the thread and it seems to be working fine. But I was wondering if I could get the display to show the rpms instead of the frenquency. I am going to try modbus, but in the meantime I would love to see the speed instead of the freaquency.

Also I saw something in the settings for the number of poles. Does this have anything to do with the number of wires, my spindle has 3 plus ground. The only choices are 2 pole and 4 pole, I do not see a 3 pole?

Also I am running 220v to it, so do i need to set A082 to 220v?

Here are the settings I used in the x200

X200 settings:
A001: 00
A002: 02
A003: 400Hz
A004: 400Hz
A061 400
A062 200
A082: 230V
A151 200
A152 400
A153 0
A154 100
A155 00

B012: 10

H003: 2.2KW
H004: 2 poles

Most likely it will be a 2 pole motor. If you switch it to 4 poles, it would most likely only do 50% of its max speed, when turned all the way up. Do you have a phototachometer yet to check the RPMS?

[allengambrell]

I got the Hitachi X200 vfd with a chinese 2.2 kw spindle working using modbus control from inside Mach 3. Use the instructions on this thread.

There is a problem with the brain that makes the spindle spin the wrong way if you have it wired correctly.

To correct this you need to invert the run cw command in the brain.

I am also using the X200 vfd to auto turn on and off the spindle cooling system. Just use the internal relay and set it to to be open on RUN (setting C029 = 00). I also have a 60 second delay programed so it waits 60 seconds after the spindle is off to turn off the cooling (setting C149 = 60.0). I also have a switch that I can manually turn on the cooling system with. I ran wires into the a0 and out the NC a2 of the vfd. This will open when the spindle is set to run. One thing though it open when you take the power off the vfd at the circut breaker, So will still have to turn off the auto switch when I am messing around without power to the vfd.

I also put a video and pics on my build thread of the cooling and modbus working.

[henrikm]

For those of you having issues with CCW rotation you could try out the brain I have tinkered with. Tested on two setups and working.

Hope this helps.


Henrik.

[Op4]

I want to thank everyone that has contributed to this thread.

I have been struggling really hard trying to get speed control to work.

I am pretty much using everything diyengineer is using, but have the cheaper converter with three pins to the CNC4PC RJ45 breakout board. Just using the 485+ and 485-. The ground pin is not attached.

I can start and stop the spindle via F5, GCODE, and GUI, but entering speed does nothing. I open the brain and view the brain while changing RPMs and the brain is updating, but the hitachi is not receiving anything.

Again, I am using the same config as everyone else.

I am starting to think its the converter, but if it was, would I still be able to start and stop and also not have speed control?

I also have my doubts about the hitachi settings causing speed to be ignored. I double and triple checked them.

I really did not want to post here because I know people have moved on from this thread, but I really do not know where else to look.

If I cannot get modbus to work, then I will be forced to do some sort of breakout board speed control or something. This shouldn't be that hard, but for some reason this is killing me.

I hope someone is still watching this thread

[diyengineer]

Buy a quality converter. The one i had off ebay was junk and didn't work. Had to get one from grainger. I cant seem to find the exact one i had, but maybe something like this would work?

EXTECH RS-232 to USB Adaptor - Power Meters and Analyzers Accessories - 4GPR3|USB100 - Grainger Industrial Supply

I want to thank everyone that has contributed to this thread.

I have been struggling really hard trying to get speed control to work.

I am pretty much using everything diyengineer is using, but have the cheaper converter with three pins to the CNC4PC RJ45 breakout board. Just using the 485+ and 485-. The ground pin is not attached.

I can start and stop the spindle via F5, GCODE, and GUI, but entering speed does nothing. I open the brain and view the brain while changing RPMs and the brain is updating, but the hitachi is not receiving anything.

Again, I am using the same config as everyone else.

I am starting to think its the converter, but if it was, would I still be able to start and stop and also not have speed control?

I also have my doubts about the hitachi settings causing speed to be ignored. I double and triple checked them.

I really did not want to post here because I know people have moved on from this thread, but I really do not know where else to look.

If I cannot get modbus to work, then I will be forced to do some sort of breakout board speed control or something. This shouldn't be that hard, but for some reason this is killing me.

I hope someone is still watching this thread

[Op4]

Buy a quality converter. The one i had off ebay was junk and didn't work. Had to get one from grainger. I cant seem to find the exact one i had, but maybe something like this would work?

EXTECH RS-232 to USB Adaptor - Power Meters and Analyzers Accessories - 4GPR3|USB100 - Grainger Industrial Supply

thanks for the reply!

Just to be clear, I have RS232 to RS485 1 2km Data Interface Adapter Converter | eBay and I am thinking that I need to get the grainger one. I learned from your experience that using the usb one was a bad idea. I was thinking of getting the one you have SPECO TECHNOLOGIES RS232 to RS485 Converter - Closed Circuit TV System Accessories - 3AEA2|RS232485C - Grainger Industrial Supply


If that doesnt fix it, then I am at a total loss on what else to do.

When I clicked use Use Spindle Motor Output in Port and Pins a message popped up saying I needed to do something with the pinouts. I have not done anything with pinouts..maybe that is my problem? I see no mention of this in the thread so I figured it wasn't an issue.

[diyengineer]

thanks for the reply!

Just to be clear, I have RS232 to RS485 1 2km Data Interface Adapter Converter | eBay and I am thinking that I need to get the grainger one. I learned from your experience that using the usb one was a bad idea. I was thinking of getting the one you have SPECO TECHNOLOGIES RS232 to RS485 Converter - Closed Circuit TV System Accessories - 3AEA2|RS232485C - Grainger Industrial Supply


If that doesnt fix it, then I am at a total loss on what else to do.

When I clicked use Use Spindle Motor Output in Port and Pins a message popped up saying I needed to do something with the pinouts. I have not done anything with pinouts..maybe that is my problem? I see no mention of this in the thread so I figured it wasn't an issue.

There you go! I couldn't find the one i had for some reason

SPECO TECHNOLOGIES RS232 to RS485 Converter - Closed Circuit TV System Accessories - 3AEA2|RS232485C - Grainger Industrial Supply

I would try that out, worked for me.

[Op4]

Just wanted to follow up that you can use USB to Serial converter as long as it is isolated. I used Amazon.com: SIIG ID-SC0J11-S1 USB to Serial Isolated Converter: Electronics

I know its spendy, but this allows me to use my laptop for controlling the x200 using the settings here. Works perfect. I tried two other usb to serial converters and they did not work.

[diyengineer]

Sig is a good brand, the junk one i had was a Chinese ebay no name special if I remember right.

[Op4]

Yeah figured so, but I know some people were having USB to serial problems and wanted to report success (if you spend the money). I had a hard drive fail on my desktop so wanted to start over with a newer laptop. I had a spare touch laptop to use, but had to figure out the no serial port problem. I took a gamble on the Sig and bamb! it worked. I have frequency and engagement working with no strange locking up on with the mouse or other peripherals.