[saturnnights]

Where do you all buy your carbide end mills? I'm mostly interested in small ones for my Taig mill - 1/8", 1/16", 3/32". I see prices vary widely and wildly. There's a guy on Ebay selling 10pc sets with a reserve of around $25.00. Now that is a good deal (I think).
I'm just really getting into the Taig CNC milling and I think that I'll eventually start eating a lot of end mills. I have a manual mill that never really used up a lot of end mills, except when I got carried away and broke 'em
Anyway, what's a good, average price and where do you get 'em from?

Thanks,
Mark

[joecnc2006]

use-enco.com

[HayTay]

I'm with Joe, I just purchased 1/16", 1/8" and 1/4", 2 flute, upcut, end mills from ENCO. Prices were $5.59, $10.39 and $13.29 respectively. Free shipping promotion code for FEB 2006 is WEBNRFB6 and is applicable on orders over $50.00.

What's the shipping on those end mills on eBay? Don't forget the $25.00 reserve is the minimum acceptable bid. Winning bids may be higher, unless you happen to luck out and be the only bidder. Are all of the end mills the same size? Also, don't forget the shank size has to be able to be held in place by your collet or chuck!

HayTay

[saturnnights]

I'm with Joe, I just purchased 1/16", 1/8" and 1/4", 2 flute, upcut, end mills from ENCO. Prices were $5.59, $10.39 and $13.29 respectively. Free shipping promotion code for FEB 2006 is WEBNRFB6 and is applicable on orders over $50.00.

What's the shipping on those end mills on eBay? Don't forget the $25.00 reserve is the minimum acceptable bid. Winning bids may be higher, unless you happen to luck out and be the only bidder. Are all of the end mills the same size? Also, don't forget the shank size has to be able to be held in place by your collet or chuck!

HayTay

I've bought a lot of endmills and lathe tooling from Enco (and Wholesale Tool) because their prices are pretty good. But I only tend to buy onsies and twosies in the past and now I'm looking for ten or twenty of each size at once. The guy on Ebay charges 6 bucks shipping. His shanks are the same diameter as the cutting end, so that's cool. I need to buy some more collets though as I only have 1/8" and 3/32" and need a few more.

Mark

[HayTay]

That sounds like it's just the ticket, then. Breaks down to $3.10 each in quantities of 10. Even if they are of low quality and break easily you're only out $31.00. If they are of average quality or better you definitely got a bargain.

If you purchase them let us know how they work out (and maybe reveal your source - 800watt or plschmitt ???).

HayTay

[saturnnights]

Okay, I've just placed an order with this guy (like goes to his "specials" page where there are inexpensive carbide endmills):

http://www.jtsmach.com/jtswebshop/as...ials_index.asp

The ones I bought ranged from $2.65 to $3.15 to $4.49 each - not too bad, really...

I've never bought end mills from 800watt, but I have bought lots of other stuff from him and have been happy. I don't know plschmitt, but thecrownattitude looks like an interesting seller.

I'll let you know how this order works - the seller lives about an hour from my house so I ought to have the order by Friday.

Mark

[Ken_Shea]

Where abouts in Ohio do you live Mark ?

Ken

[saturnnights]

Where abouts in Ohio do you live Mark ?

Ken

I'm in Akron

[saturnnights]

I'll let you know how this order works - the seller lives about an hour from my house so I ought to have the order by Friday.

Mark

Well, here's my report on JTS Machinery:

They called me this morning to inform me that their pricing had increased - after I'd placed my order online. I had several items in my order and he went one-by-one through the list giving me the new/actual prices - all of them were from 50 cents to $1.50 more each than their website had them listed for. Then he asked if I wanted to cancel my order!?!?! Heck yeah!

So, I went and looked at their website prices - no change...

Bait and switch? You decide... :devious:

Mark

[lerman]

I once went to place an order with them and discovered that the credit card info is an http:// page; not an https:// page. For some reason, I can't bring myself to enter credit card info on an insecure page.

Maybe that has something to do with the fact that the last time I ran snoop on my internet connection, I could see traffic from the local high school. Really.

Ken

[PEU]

I purchased from ebay seller: http://stores.ebay.com/carbide-toolcom they sell 10x 1/8" endmills or ball mills for $8.50 the pack shipped, an excellet deal if you ask me.

[saturnnights]

I purchased from ebay seller: http://stores.ebay.com/carbide-toolcom they sell 10x 1/8" endmills or ball mills for $8.50 the pack shipped, an excellet deal if you ask me.

Wow - now that IS a great deal! I'm gonna try them and see how it goes. I wonder how long shipping will take from Hong Kong to the USA? Hmmmm...

Mark

[cpmfastools]

If you are forced into buying tooling that might not be considered top notch consider cryogenic processing. We see a much better result processing sub standard tooling then top of the line. This is due to the less strict/manual manufacture process used for lower cost tools. The premium tool manufacturers have a stricter control over their heat treat and temper process as opposed to the lower cost tool manufacturers and are generally automated in their post process treatments. Cryogenics make up for the lower precision in lower cost tooling. Just a thought for those looking to extend the life of their tooling.

[saturnnights]

[QUOTE=cpmfastools]If you are forced into buying tooling that might not be considered top notch consider cryogenic processing. [QUOTE]

How does cryogenic processing work? I mean, do I do it?

[cpmfastools]

The heat treat and tempering process of a tool leaves a lot of internal stress in the part. This stress effects the cutting edge of the tool, how long it will hold its edge, basically how long it will last. The technical side of things goes something like this; After heat treat and tempering there remains stress in the part. This is referenced as retained austenite and martensite, they way the carbon interacts with ferrous metal. Having the two creates internal stress in the part. By cryogenic processing the metal you convert the austenite to martensite thus relieving this stress leaving a more stable material. Another way cryogenic processing reduces the stress in an object is by re-organizing the locations of the atoms within the structure. When you think about the heat treat process the atoms are not equally distributed through out the part. Think of a box of ping pong balls shuffled around most of the ball would be gathered together in a corner with a few a randomly arranged elsewhere. Cryogenic processing re distributes them equally with respect to each other. This is why processing of non ferrous metals in addition to thermoplastics and rubber gain in wear resistance.

Hope that answers your question as to what cryogenic processing is. As far as how to do it? The process is basically applying liquid nitrogen in a controller manner inside a container holding your part. Cryogenics had a rough early start, most people tried (and most failed) by simply placing there part in a bucket and pouring LN2 directly over the part. Even early processing chambers used spray elements to bathe the part in LN2. Imagine how you would feel going from 70 to -312 in a few seconds. Well the metal felt the same way. Our chamber cost 40K has two computers that control both the cryo and the tempering of the process. Total cycle time from loading the parts to removing them takes about 20 hours. It takes about 12 hours just to go from room temperature to -312 degrees it then cycles, soaks and then slowly comes back up to room temp. This helps to avoid shocking the material.

The cost can vary from processor to processor but expect to pay about 1.00 for inserts and about 2-5.00 for tools depending on the size. We use ours primarily for internal processing of laser sintered inserts we use in a our injection mold tooling, leader pins, bushings, sprues, ejector pins and the like all go through the process. But we also process for outside customers as well, tooling, punch dies just about anything you can think of we have processed.

We actually have a wireless web cam in the cryo/rapid proto type room. Streams real time images through the website.

http://www.cpmfastools.com/c/108/webcams

If you look straight down you will see the set-up.

Steve

[saturnnights]

Interesting - thanks for the explanation! I used to work with LN2 when I was a biologist/research type years ago - crazy, dangerous stuff!

Mark

The heat treat and tempering process of a tool leaves a lot of internal stress in the part. This stress effects the cutting edge of the tool, how long it will hold its edge, basically how long it will last. The technical side of things goes something like this; After heat treat and tempering there remains stress in the part. This is referenced as retained austenite and martensite, they way the carbon interacts with ferrous metal. Having the two creates internal stress in the part. By cryogenic processing the metal you convert the austenite to martensite thus relieving this stress leaving a more stable material. Another way cryogenic processing reduces the stress in an object is by re-organizing the locations of the atoms within the structure. When you think about the heat treat process the atoms are not equally distributed through out the part. Think of a box of ping pong balls shuffled around most of the ball would be gathered together in a corner with a few a randomly arranged elsewhere. Cryogenic processing re distributes them equally with respect to each other. This is why processing of non ferrous metals in addition to thermoplastics and rubber gain in wear resistance.

Hope that answers your question as to what cryogenic processing is. As far as how to do it? The process is basically applying liquid nitrogen in a controller manner inside a container holding your part. Cryogenics had a rough early start, most people tried (and most failed) by simply placing there part in a bucket and pouring LN2 directly over the part. Even early processing chambers used spray elements to bathe the part in LN2. Imagine how you would feel going from 70 to -312 in a few seconds. Well the metal felt the same way. Our chamber cost 40K has two computers that control both the cryo and the tempering of the process. Total cycle time from loading the parts to removing them takes about 20 hours. It takes about 12 hours just to go from room temperature to -312 degrees it then cycles, soaks and then slowly comes back up to room temp. This helps to avoid shocking the material.

The cost can vary from processor to processor but expect to pay about 1.00 for inserts and about 2-5.00 for tools depending on the size. We use ours primarily for internal processing of laser sintered inserts we use in a our injection mold tooling, leader pins, bushings, sprues, ejector pins and the like all go through the process. But we also process for outside customers as well, tooling, punch dies just about anything you can think of we have processed.

We actually have a wireless web cam in the cryo/rapid proto type room. Streams real time images through the website.

http://www.cpmfastools.com/c/108/webcams

If you look straight down you will see the set-up.

Steve