[thudson]

I picked up my HF44991 Monday, and I am in the process of tearing it down and cleaning it up.

I plan on polishing the gibs and dovetails before it goes back together, but I was wondering if there are any other mods I should do while I have it apart.

What is the general consensus on filling the bottom six inches of the column with epoxy? What kind of filler should I use?

I also know that the torsion spring will have to go at some point. A counterweight like Hoss's machine or an LMS airspring kit?

I plan on using it as a manual mill to machine parts for the CNC conversion, being more included to build than buy.

Any other mods?

[port_huon]

A belt drive is a 'must have' modification but doesn't need the machine to be disassembled to fit it.
I have the air spring from LMS. It does require a couple of holes to be drilled in the mill head which may be easier with the mill in pieces.

There are various posts regarding filling the bottom of the column with epoxy - pro and con.
Try replacing the round washer under the nut that holds on the column with a larger square one. There are a number of thread on this topic - here's a very complete one from dougal.
And don't forget to visit Hoss's site for all things X2.

[thudson]

There are various posts regarding filling the bottom of the column with epoxy - pro and con.

I've searched for 'epoxy' and found many threads, but I didn't see any cons. What are the downsides of the epoxy fill?

[port_huon]

I've searched for 'epoxy' and found many threads, but I didn't see any cons. What are the downsides of the epoxy fill?

What I meant was there's probably little advantage in filling the column with epoxy on such a small machine. The consensus seems to be that a column brace of some sort will give better rigidity.
The only real downside will be a hell of a mess doing it.

[thudson]

What I meant was there's probably little advantage in filling the column with epoxy on such a small machine. The consensus seems to be that a column brace of some sort will give better rigidity.
The only real downside will be a hell of a mess doing it.

Thanks. Yeah, it's a mess to clean up. And expensive. I have West System on hand from building a canoe.

[hoss2006]

Cut away the throat at the front of the base, it'll give you a quick extra 3/4 inches of Y travel.
Pics located here.
http://www.hossmachine.info/cnc_conv...ml#Fabrication
Hoss

[TroyO]

I'm expecting an X2 later this week. Thudson, I hope you don't mind a "Hijack" but it looks like we are both after the exact same info... LOL.

Hoss, that mod to get the 3/4" inch... you just bring that boss down to even with the front web? Nice, I like easy! I've got just the monster file for the job too. LOL...

Any other travel hacks to gain a little here and there without anything too complicated for a newb?

I've been looking at the epoxy fill... I'm going with the KISS principle and I'm just going to get a pint of 2 hour epoxy and mix it with concrete mix as a filler. Just the regular Home Depot 8 oz bottles of the epoxy... and 2 hour cure or longer if they have it. I think, with the filler it will be enough?

I figure it can't hurt... it either sticks and bonds up solid in which case I'm good... or it's gonna NOT stick and work right, in which case I can probably get it out and try again.

[thudson]

I'm expecting an X2 later this week. Thudson, I hope you don't mind a "Hijack" but it looks like we are both after the exact same info... LOL.

No problem. It seems quite a few of us here are the next wave of X2 users. Hope we can learn from each other, as well as the experienced X2ers.

I'm using crevicereamers teardown and cleaning guide:

http://crevicereamer.com/Page_9.html

I couldn't find kerosene anywhere, but the local Lowes had mineral spirits. I've also found WD40 comes in handy for some of the tight spots for cleaning.

You'll be cursing the 'red goo' guy when you start cleaning.

[hoss2006]

Hoss, that mod to get the 3/4" inch... you just bring that boss down to even with the front web? Nice, I like easy! I've got just the monster file for the job too. LOL...

Any other travel hacks to gain a little here and there without anything too complicated for a newb?

Sure , these for travels.
http://www.hossmachine.info/X2_Travel_Increases.html

these for rigidity.
http://www.hossmachine.info/Shop_Info.html#x2%20column

When it's back together, check the tram.
http://www.hossmachine.info/Shop_Info.html#tramming
Hoss

[TroyO]

Thanks Hoss! There's sooo much info on your site, half the battle is finding it (And debating whether or not I *really* have the skill to pull it off.. LOL)

My immediate list, during the initial build...

Cleaning

More cleaning

Way smoothing

Gib polish

The 3/4" boss Y Mod (That's within my abilities)

Epoxy column fill.

Back support plate. I may upgrade that to the bolt on style later.

Full tramming out of the column to base and spindle to column.


After build:

Belt drive, using Hoss's plans. I have an 8x12 lathe and a pile of round AL stock I got at 2$ a pound.
I am considering using a 1/4" motor mount plate and some washers to fill the gap between the mounting plate and the motor where the bolts are... it just seems easier to make since I don't know how to do that recessed hole with the tools I have.
For the base plate I'm thinking I can cut the big hole just using a hole saw.. it won't be exact but "close enough".

Maybe buy a spare base (I think I read somewhere that you can order a spare base for $20 and $10 shipping...) and try some of those more advanced travel mods on one I can "wreck" and not have the machine down if I screw it up.

[TroyO]

Hmmm, that air spring upgrade seems pretty reasonably priced.

If I understand correctly, it's a better balance for the head and also extends the travel? How important is that manual use, or is it primarilly a CNC thing?

[BobWarfield]

I've been looking at the epoxy fill... I'm going with the KISS principle and I'm just going to get a pint of 2 hour epoxy and mix it with concrete mix as a filler. Just the regular Home Depot 8 oz bottles of the epoxy... and 2 hour cure or longer if they have it. I think, with the filler it will be enough?

I figure it can't hurt... it either sticks and bonds up solid in which case I'm good... or it's gonna NOT stick and work right, in which case I can probably get it out and try again.

Think of the epoxy granite mixture as being all about damping, rather than rigidity. By all means do the rigidity mods to the column that a lot of X2 owners do. I like the idea of bolting a full length piece of channel, for example.

How much difference will the damping make? I did a fill on my Industrial Hobbies mill, and I would estimate it as a 15-20% effect. 15-20% smoother, able to take more aggressive cuts, etc. The mill "feels" more solid and doesn't "ring" when you tap the column or base.

You can see more about my fill here:

http://www.cnccookbook.com/CCMillEpo...lEpoxyFill.htm

It actually is very easy. I would definitely recommend a mixture of "fill" and not just the concrete mix. The damping effects comes from the epoxy trying to "wiggle" around all the different aggregate sizes. There is a lot of value in different sizes. As you can see from my article, it's easy to figure out the proportions by simply experimenting with water until you get down to the percentage of epoxy you want to use in your mix. Very high quality commercial epoxy ganite gets below 10%. I got down to maybe 14% and it was very easy to work with.

Be careful of the resins--they can cause a nasty allergic reaction. DAMHIK.

Cheers,

BW

[knudsen]

You guys ever try brass gibs? I was going to but started by testing with a copper shim. Works well. Might lead to more frequent gibs adjustments.

[thudson]

You guys ever try brass gibs? I was going to but started by testing with a copper shim. Works well. Might lead to more frequent gibs adjustments.

I thought about it. It might be my first machining project. Seems like an enterprising individual could sell replacement sets for the X2.

I finished up my y-axis today and I'm very pleased with the results. I have no play and smooth travel from end to end (just sliding by hand). Added some lithium grease and now it's smooth as butter.

I haven't done the y-axis mod yet. I'm looking for a lazy man's way of doing it. Maybe on my drill press, finishing off with a hand grinder.

[TroyO]

There's a post a couple down where someone is making a set of brass gibs as part of an X2 way extension.

http://www.cnczone.com/forums/showth...=100770&page=9

I may give it a try... although I would probably do it the cheesey way.. LOL. Lay a couple of strips of sheet stock over the important bits and clamp the brass chunk in to the dovetail then flat file it.. then flip and repeat. It gets the angle right and although it's not laser like accuracy it should work OK.

I made a replacement for an unrelated part that way once, I used a round rod and some C clamps to hold the metal stock against the dovetail... (Arrows are the clamping force)

Like this: --> O\\__ <--

Anyway... it gives folks without a secondary mill a method to try.

What general size are the stock gibs? I may go ahead and get some brass bar stock... seems it wouldn't take that much longer than refinishing the existing gibs.

[TroyO]

Hmmm, another potential mod....

http://www.fignoggle.com/machines/x2...acklashNut.htm

[thudson]

Hmmm, another potential mod....

http://www.fignoggle.com/machines/x2...acklashNut.htm

Thanks for this. I was actually thinking about something like this when I was taking it apart.

I also got an idea this morning about reassembling the table and mounting it upside down on my drill press and cut the y-axis mod with an end mill, using the x and y of the table to do the cut.

Am I crazy?

[degreaser]

There's a post a couple down where someone is making a set of brass gibs as part of an X2 way extension.

<snip>

What general size are the stock gibs? I may go ahead and get some brass bar stock... seems it wouldn't take that much longer than refinishing the existing gibs.

That would be me. You could do it with one mill by using your existing mill to make a jig. I described one way of making the jig in the thread. I'm sure there are better ways. There's also a diagram which indicates how to calculate the size of the blank and the depth of the various cuts. While I used telescoping gauges, you can use feeler gauges to measure the required gib thickness.

If you go this route, make the jig around 7.5" long to eliminate the clamping problems I experienced with the x-axis gib.

Without measuring, the stock gibs are about 3/16" x .5". That's just a guesstimate. Measure three times, cut once. 1/4" x 1/2" stock might be better from a clamping perspective. I used a high lead brass alloy that cuts very nicely. I got it from onlinemetals.

[knudsen]

I may give it a try... although I would probably do it the cheesey way.. LOL. Lay a couple of strips of sheet stock over the important bits and clamp the brass chunk in to the dovetail then flat file it.. then flip and repeat. It gets the angle right and although it's not laser like accuracy it should work OK.

Not half as cheesey as just putting a shim under the gib and calling it done, like I did LOL :rainfro:

IMHO: You could about skip the angle if you wanted. Just make it narrow enough to fit in without. You'll just loose a little surface area, and it won't be under the screws where all the pressure is. So file away!. Or don't :rainfro: Guarantee if you use brass or copper gibs it will be way way smoother.

I axed Chris at LMS what to use for brass gibs for a mini-mill and lathe, he said

360 brass will work fine for your gibs.

[Teyber12]

try turning on your spindle and rubbing a dry sponge up in your spindle. i had .002" runout but i guess there was some mdf dust or something in there as when i sponged it my runout went to .00025". Hope its something like this.

cheers