[MFchief]

Hi All,

I'm wondering how to handle the Z in terms of part top when there are steps? I want to spot drill and then drill holes on the top of a part which has a step of about .4" and I want to drill in both section of the part. I'm not using CAM, just planning to hand code, but I'm not sure how to handle the difference in height.

Terry

[rayoung]

Hi Terry,

If they are through holes or going to the same depth and time isn't a factor I would set my Z zero to the highest part and set the clearance from there and just let it drill all the holes till it got down to depth. If the holes are different depths then you can set it as 2 separate drilling cycles with z set for each height and depth.

Ray

[Gerry Sweetland]

Hi Terry,
I'm afraid I don't know G-code very well but I do have CAM and ran a model through the post processor to get some G-code.
Don't know if it just muddies the water or if it helps but here is the G-code...

N440 S5000 M3
N450 G0
N460 X0.5 Y-1. Z0.2062
N470 G0 M8
N480 G98 G81 Z-0.4501 R0.1 F5
N490 X1.5 Z-0.8501
N500 G80
N510 G0 M5 M9
N520 (Inch)
N530 M998
N540 M5 M9
N550 M30
%

And attached is a drawing of the model I used. It is a PDF file.
HTH
Gerry

I forgot to put a note on the drawing where 0,0,0 is.
It is (in the top view) top of part in the north west corner.

[Just Me]

A simple answer to your question would be to use more than 1 R Value and Z detph...As long as you use G98 not G99

I've added a few lines of code to Gerry's program so it reads like this...

N440 S5000 M3
N450 G0
N460 X0.5 Y-1.
N461 Z0.5 M8
N480 G98 G81 Z-0.4501 R0.1 F5
N490 X1.5 Z-0.8501 R-.4
N491 X3 Z-2. R-1.5
N500 G80
N510 G0 M5 M9
N520 (Inch)
N530 M998
N540 M5 M9
N550 M30


Becuase we are using a G98 after each hole the tool will move back to the last Z plane before G81...Then it will move to next hole (in X or Y) before rapiding down to next R-Plane...If you used a G99 your tool will move to the next hole after returning to R plane on that line of code...So if your R-Plane was R-1.0 and the next holes R-Plane was R-.5 the tool would first move in X Y before going up to Z-.5...
You can have as many R-Planes and Z move as you need after the G81-84 and before the G80 (cancel cycle)

[MFchief]

Guys,

Thanks for your help! I hadn't even thought about setting different R values with the canned cycles. After you pointed it out it is pretty straight forward. Thanks again, taking the time to model my question and write code for it was awesome! Another example of why this it the best group out there.

Terry

[BAMCNC.COM]

Why can't you just draw it in your CAD like in real life? Like myself, I have 2 vices drawn in my cad, soft jaws in each with different heights, no messing around once its setup.

We are moving in the direction of technology, does it make us dumber for not knowing GCode like the old timers? No... Not at all, we are using technology to our advantage, which I believe is more efficient.... Work smarter not harder... Of course you still need to know GCode, but you don't need to edit it, its all in your CAD/CAM, learn that instead.

[Just Me]

Using technology and understanding technology are two differnce thing...Only a Kid would post this...I'm sure when you're an"Old Timer" you'll see this...
Why would you waste your time drawing a vise to program a part?

[BAMCNC.COM]

Let's see... I draw 2 rectangles in 5 seconds, vs. you editing gcode for how long now... If you don't understand what I'm saying, then don't bother replying negatively.

Common sense isn't that common anymore, and its sad.

[Just Me]

Let's see... I draw 2 rectangles in 5 seconds, vs. you editing gcode for how long now... If you don't understand what I'm saying, then don't bother replying negatively.

Common sense isn't that common anymore, and its sad.

What does drawing two rectagles have anything to do with this thread about R-Planes and Z depth?
why do you need to draw a vise to program a part?
Kids can't tell them anything...
Just go have your milk and cookies...

[FuriousGeorge]

What does drawing two rectagles have anything to do with this thread about R-Planes and Z depth?
why do you need to draw a vise to program a part?
Kids can't tell them anything...
Just go have your milk and cookies...

Tyring to start fights on the internet just makes you immature. Nobody wants to see these type of posts, so please keep any non-constructive criticism to yourself. Thank you.


I never hand-write gcode. Say I want to make a fixture plate in CAD/CAM. I can copy and paste some hole locations directly from my part, pattern this over the entire plate and have the g-code to drill hundreds of holes at different Z-depths in less than 5-minutes with a pretty much nil chance of making a typo. Knowing CAM is an absolute game changer for productivity. Simply put, if you don't know at least some basic CAD/CAM, you are not getting anywhere near your machine's full potential.

[Just Me]

Tyring to start fights on the internet just makes you immature. Nobody wants to see these type of posts, so please keep any non-constructive criticism to yourself. Thank you.
.

Not trying to start anything with you folks...But both you and BAMCNC missed the boat on this one...

Hi All,

I'm wondering how to handle the Z in terms of part top when there are steps? I want to spot drill and then drill holes on the top of a part which has a step of about .4" and I want to drill in both section of the part. I'm not using CAM, just planning to hand code, but I'm not sure how to handle the difference in height.

Terry

Drawing a fixture plate or rectangle has nothing to do with programming muli R-Planes and Z depth...
If you think any cam system will output a code that could not be improved with some hand editting...
Simply put, if you don't know at least some basic hand coding, you are not getting anywhere near your machine's full potential.

[FuriousGeorge]

If you think any cam system will output a code that could not be improved with some hand editting...
Simply put, if you don't know at least some basic hand coding, you are not getting anywhere near your machine's full potential.

Couldn't agree with you more on that one. I tweak and edit codes by hand all the time, but I find that it's more efficient to do the brunt of the work with CAD/CAM.

[BAMCNC.COM]

Ok, maybe all CAM isn't created equal, but I learned my CAM well enough that I don't hand edit anything anymore, I made my own POST aswell.

I can have each rectangle (outline of vice jaws) at different heights... Do you understand CAD?

Simply put, its in your CAD/CAM, I can do 99% of anything in my CAD/CAM as you can do editing GCode.

I'm not writing a tutorial, or being arrogant, but its people who do not try, that upset me.

Quick example as I'm on my phone here... People will draw their part, and then move it directly to CAM... Well... that is wrong.. already... I may have one part, but only need certain machining in certain areas with a certain endmill, but not the whole profile, or whatever your doing. Simply copy and paste your part, edit out the crap you don't want in CAM then move it back over your other part on another layer... (30 sec) I may have as many as 10-15 layers on my part (extreme) but usually 2 or 3. In CAM now all you do is select that layer and go.

It's very hard to explain, but I challange you to think outside the box, quit being belligerent, and move into the future and learn how to "out smart" technology.

Technology is only as smart as the operator... If you don't understand it, dont argue trying to prove a point if your not willing to understand, ask questions and try it.

Simple reply to my 1st post in this thread would of been HOW?

[Just Me]

Bammyboy...It is very clear from your last post what ever software you are using you don't know how to us it correctly...
The thread was about a guy asking a question on hand coding...What part of that did you not understand...
I'm sure I could run circles around using cad/cam ...
But that becuase I understand technology...where you only use it the best you can...Keep trying kid maybe someday you will figuire it out...

[BAMCNC.COM]

Ignorance is Bliss

[mrquacker]

Ok, maybe all CAM isn't created equal, but I learned my CAM well enough that I don't hand edit anything anymore, I made my own POST aswell.

I can have each rectangle (outline of vice jaws) at different heights... Do you understand CAD?

Simply put, its in your CAD/CAM, I can do 99% of anything in my CAD/CAM as you can do editing GCode.

I'm not writing a tutorial, or being arrogant, but its people who do not try, that upset me.

Quick example as I'm on my phone here... People will draw their part, and then move it directly to CAM... Well... that is wrong.. already... I may have one part, but only need certain machining in certain areas with a certain endmill, but not the whole profile, or whatever your doing. Simply copy and paste your part, edit out the crap you don't want in CAM then move it back over your other part on another layer... (30 sec) I may have as many as 10-15 layers on my part (extreme) but usually 2 or 3. In CAM now all you do is select that layer and go.

It's very hard to explain, but I challange you to think outside the box, quit being belligerent, and move into the future and learn how to "out smart" technology.

Technology is only as smart as the operator... If you don't understand it, dont argue trying to prove a point if your not willing to understand, ask questions and try it.

Simple reply to my 1st post in this thread would of been HOW?

What CAM do you use?

[TurboStep]

People will draw their part, and then move it directly to CAM... Well... that is wrong.. already...

Well that's quite a sweeping statement, and as such is clearly wrong. That's exactly what I do "most" of the time and it's right for me. Every job is different, and everyone's needs, interests or environments are also likely to be different. There's no one single correct workflow. Your statement is a classic example of NOT thinking out of the box, and I quote:

I challange you to think outside the box

Although I do edit G-Code manually I believe that I'm still too dependent on my CAM. I'm convinced that for some very simple jobs it would be much more efficient just to hack some G-Code into an editor. As a result of this thread I will now be making a more concerned effort to actually do this.
I don't usually need any tools to add 2 numbers together. For division I normally grab a calculator and maybe a computer for linear regression. Choose the best tool for the job and not just the the most complex and capable at your disposal. Oh yes, and thinking out of the box is best done with the lid open
Step

[BAMCNC.COM]

If only there was a way to do a head to head competition... Good luck in your efforts to beat technology.... Because its not going to work.

Like I said earlier, ignorance is bliss... I guess...

[rlockwood]

I am proud to say I largely disagree with both sides of this argument

I believe its incredibly important to know how each and every portion of g-code functions.

I also believe CAM is absolutely capable of producing SIGNIFICANTLY more efficient* toolpath/programs than anyone could POSSIBLY achieve manually, and in SIGNIFICANTLY less time.

NUMEROUS CAM systems can analyze a 3d model and practically instantly determine drilled features, including producing spot drill code that will minimize clearance planes to an equal height above the top of the hole, produce drill code with relevant tool sizes, determine when additional processes (reaming, tapping, etc) are required and subsequently produce the necessary code. It's here. I use it every day.

That's drilling; TRY and compete with ANY of the modern 3d roughing strategies on the market by hand; many of them with reduce rapid planes based on stock removed, some will even produce 3d rapid arcs that quite literally sweep within minimal distances of roughed stock.

But on the other hand, its increasingly important to understand what the code is doing, and all of the ways you can help modern CAM systems integrate with your machine/controller. Ideally, this would all be taken care of by the CAM developer themselves; but the reality is that CNC machining is constantly evolving, and its virtually impossible for any software developer to ensure 100% compatibility with all of the controllers out there. And that's just compatibility. Ensuring efficiency will almost surely require a great deal of optimization on your end, which will require extensive knowledge of what every single bit and byte are doing throughout every combination of code you can manage to output.

Among the smartest advice I feel ive ever been given goes something like.. Don't spend 5 minutes a day doing something you can automate in 20."

If you're finding yourself constantly fixing the output from your CAM software, you're likely burning HOURS. Especially if they're things that would otherwise cause loud bangs and broken tools if/when you forget.

Anyhow, the question was answered long ago, and quite properly indeed.

[Just Me]

If only there was a way to do a head to head competition... Good luck in your efforts to beat technology.... Because its not going to work.

Like I said earlier, ignorance is bliss... I guess...

Well you must be the happiest person in the world...

There no way to do a competion with you Bammycnc...As you program from 2D geometry and I program from solids...I have not used a 2D drawing in years...
So what Software are you trying to use Bammy...