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Would love to see more action and reviews on the board. I would like this lathe to be a good unit, but I'm not feeling safe until We get some more happy users. Any Ideas as to the number of units out in the field at this time?
Any of the people that are running them care to share some more feedback and videos?
Thanks!
So far I am happy with mine. There are some things I do not like but overall the experience has been more on the good side. I will try and film some jobs to post on here..
Anything new you have noticed that you didn't post on your other thread?Quote:
Originally Posted by compunerdy
I see that Tormach just posted 3 new SPL15 videos:
Tormach 15L Slant-PRO Lathe Demonstration #1 - YouTube
Tormach 15L Slant-PRO Lathe Demonstration #2 - YouTube
Tormach 15L Slant-PRO Lathe Demonstration #3 - YouTube
They have dveloped a series of cut screens at the beginning of these videos, sort of like they did with the mill, but focused on the lathe.
I was hoping they would show the enclosure or the turret in these, but no such luck.
Looks like the full enclosure won't be available until year's end at best and at least a few of us are waiting for that and/or the turret version (which won't be sold without the full enclosure) to be available before buying.
That said, I wouldn't mind a few other reviews either. Tormach probably still provides contact info for their customers that are will to discuss or demo their mills and probably their lathes as well. It could be worth checking that out.
I've had mine sitting un-powered in my shop since June. In terms of quality, the functionally-important parts that matter seem to be pretty well done, and the cosmetic/non-functional parts seem to be rather poorly done in certain areas. The serial number on my machine is in the 20s. I'm hoping to get it powered up next month (need to run a new circuit to it) but I too have been waiting on the turret and enclosure to become available for sale. I don't see the point in investing in a QCTP or gang plate if I eventually go for the turret and enclosure like I'm planning to do. I wish they'd get it done already, or at least give us some kind of an update. It's been a while.
I also really want the enclosure and tool changer but I will be using my QCTP as well.. there is no way the changer will hold enough tools so it will get the most used ones and the QCTP will hold any others I need.
It is a machine tool, after all. The cosmetics will be even worse once you start spraying coolant through it. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by sanddrag
I am sure that the rough edges will be fixed by the time the Series III rolls around... maybe the enclosure will be released by then too. Look how long it took them to release an ATC and enclosure for the 1100...
The conversational is cool but I find myself wishing it was Mach a lot. no wireless, no screen saver, no easy single click to tell the machine you changed the tool, no memory on the MDI line, cant move in 2 directions at once with keyboard, etc..
I'm happy with mine. I had a few bugs in the beginning but I just ran a 50 piece job and am holding pretty good tolerances. I have a prototype air closer and it really makes life nice. I am running gang tooling and like it. I would still buy the turret/enclosure when available. I've also been playing around with a bar puller which is really nice. You can't run anything over 3' though until you get some kind of support for the stock.
Would love to see some pics of your air closer setup. Is it a Tormach prototype or one you made?
It's Tormach's closer.
I got a update on my comments above.. I guess it would help if I looked into things more before running my mouth lol
“The conversational is cool but I find myself wishing it was Mach a lot. no wireless, no screen saver, no easy single click to tell the machine you changed the tool, no memory on the MDI line, cant move in 2 directions at once with keyboard, etc..”
Wireless is there and supported via USB WiFi dongle: Tormach PN 34705. You won’t be able to surf the internet, but you can use the machine as network-attached storage for your CAD/CAM computer. Details on how to set this up are in the manual.
No screen saver – correct. The screen savers were causing problems with response time on wake up so we disabled them. If you’re not using the machine for more than an hour or so it would be a good idea to power down anyway. I find that people tend to leave their computers on for days at a time, which is not the best practice.
Single click to indicate tool change is the Cycle Start button if the tool change is requested during a part program. Is that what you mean? Or do you want a tool DRO? Typing ‘T2’ in the MDI line seems like not much more work than typing ‘2’ in the tool DRO.
MDI memory is supported. Just like Mach, you use the up/down arrow keys while the MDI line has focus.
Two button jogging should be in place on our next software release.
Here are some other updates that I am sure they do not mind me sharing..
As Menzzer stated they are working on the Air closer and currently waiting on some parts..
For the enclosure/tool changer.. Enclosure is in production – no firm date yet on when they will be here. The turrets are here and ready to go, but can’t sell them without the enclosure. Sorry to be so elusive on a firm date, but we’ve learned the hard way that when we promise something and then a last minute hiccup comes along people get much more upset than when we give very conservative estimates (or no estimates at all).
My GT-27 is for sale - 12k - Not sure how that compares to the Tormach as far as price, but know it's around 6x the machine.
Don't you have two of those? Do we get to chose which one we buy for $12k? :DQuote:
Originally Posted by BAMCNC.COM
Iowa is a bit too far away for me... here in the PNW, good, reasonably priced used machinery is difficult to find.
I've had mine ( #46 ) for a month or so now. Basically for the $ it's a good solid piece of iron. I ran a set of jam nuts with a fine 1" internal thread and the threading and tolerances were very consistent. I had to run off a few pieces for fixtures and the conversation mode makes this productive as long as the part geometry fits into the conversational set ( meaning forward facing features ). I had to make some one-off mandrils and spacers; I don't think it would have been faster on a manual lathe. There's an issues that you would have with any open loop machine:
If you need tight tolerances you need to re-check and tweak your tool offsets between power cycles. The tool gets it's zero references from micro switches which can be off from one reset to the next. I was using a boring bar up on the gang plate and external tool on the QCTP, so I found what worked was to cut a test piece with an arbitrary external and internal diameter, put some Dykem on them and touch tools off by jogging them in at .0001 steps with the jogging dial, then adjust the offsets in the tool table. This sounds a little overkill, but really just takes about 10 - 15 minutes. Once the tools are dialed in they are *very* accurate, but then I decided to spend the extra bucks and go with Dorian.
I got this machine because I know that Tormach will support it and bring some great solutions going forward.
My main complaint at this point is with SprutCAM8. There was no post processor that I know of for their lathe XZ. The sample I got from Tormach just isn't *there* yet. I have a software engineering background so last week I decided to use the Sprut post processor generation tool and get into it. It's *almost* working, but the problem is with SprutCAM. Clearly these guys are bunch of Russian math geniuses and have gotten all the heavy stuff ( 5 axis milling ) done, but poor old lathe XZ has some serious bugs - just look at the approach tool path of a drilling op. It looks like they haven't touched this code since whenever, so it makes for some very messy logic in the post processor to clean these things up. My $.02
@compunerdy: Thanks for the update on MDI memory! I was running out of scratch paper.
My biggest gripe at this point is sprut as well.. It just works so much less efficient on the lathe than it does for the mill. I am sure there is some learning curve there but you cant even set speeds and feeds per tool. It constantly changes my setting between mm/inch, programs tools to crash into the part on tool change, etc..
The reason I could not get the MDI to work is the keyboard I am using does not have the 4 arrow keys by themselves.. only the numpad ones. On Mach either set will work but not on the lathe.
Tmarks - haha the OLD one, in this playlist https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...usKCeR7kBZABWb
been getting PMs on both lathe and mill, but is the PM system broken?
Lots of PM's on the lathe, but no replies. I don't think my PM's are working, I go to the sent folder and it's messages from last year? Message me on YouTube or Instagram or something, I know they work.
https://www.youtube.com/user/TacticalKeychains
So can this thing hold at least 7 tenths on .5" ID or even a .375" ID bore. I'm machining aluminum at the moment and would like machine stainless as well-I'm guessing no on the stainless with this machine. What kind of surface finish are you guys achieving?
I'm prototyping right now on a manual lathe. These are small parts, and I have bearing seats to deal with, and I'm currently using a roller burnishing tool on the seats to get within 0 to .0003". I may investigate honing as well, but there are benefits to roller burnishing such as finish and cold hardening the seats. It takes me a little while to make these parts by hand. I eventually want to produce parts. I have been looking at used 20 year old big CNC iron. Only problem is finding one local at a good price and fitting it in at my house until I can get an industrial space--about 1.5 years away. Just moving 10K lb lathes cost about $1500.
My hope would be to use this lathe to speed up my prototyping at home and do some small productions runs eventually in 6061 and 7075. I have been looking for a good used gt27, but they are fetching pretty high premiums at the moment. I live in No. California.
My experience is it should easily hold 7 tenths. The trick is to approach critical diameters cuts from the same direction as you zero the tool on the radial ( X ) axis. Otherwise you encounter backlash, which is inherent in an open loop tool. Same is true on the Tormach mill. If you have say a hole pattern and setup your strategy such that all holes are approached from the same direction on the lead screws, the thing gets freakishly accurate. But on diameters that small, why not use a chucking reamer. The machine has 3 HP to spindle so I don't see why stainless should be a problem. BTW, I also live in NorCal up in Marin.
Thanks for the prompt response. I have tried reaming bearing seats with mixed results. I have found roller burnishing to be the best/cheapest solution so far with the added benefits of work hardening the bearing seats and leaving a very fine finish. As far as reaming and then roller burnishing,it is not not recommended as it leaves tears that are hard to remove with the roller burnisher. It is recommend to use a boring bar to get the proper surface finish.
Agreed, I've used roller burnishers before for the same application. As I remember we were holding 2 tenths in cast aluminum, no problem over runs of several thousand, with all the benefits you mentioned. I didn't know you could get them that small, but cool! The Tormach, for the money, is a great prototyping / short run tool. For long runs you might be bugged by the rapid speeds ( they are steppers ). They have come out with a tail stock also. My main complaint, as I've mentioned is with SprutCAM, which is still pretty buggy, but is usable and generates good code. I've been using my own post-processor so I can have both gang tool and QCTP working on the same part. Here's a cheesy video I made for a coolant fitting:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YEKuTcVpQ58
Thanks, great video! You are starting to win me over more.....Can it handle stainless 303 or even 304 and 316?Quote:
Originally Posted by adamvs
The benefits of running a small machine at my house without annoying my good neighbors is a big plus as well.
Yeah, my smallest is a 0.375" roller burnisher (off ebay, almost new) and I believe they go even smaller. It is adjustable by 0.0001" increments. Just getting the correct suface finish and proper dimention to start with for the burnisher can be trying on my manual lathe-lots of scaped parts.
Also, is that coolant spash contained ok?
I haven't run stainless, but at 3HP there's plenty of power. It's more a matter of getting the right inserts and having an aggressive metal removal strategy so you can get the toll under any work hardening.Quote:
Originally Posted by CNCAuburn
I run this at home also, and my neighbors are a concern. So far so good. As long as I'm not wolfing past 10pm and don't have Metalica going on the stereo, it's a fairly quiet machine. In fact they've joked about the weird noises coming out of my garage.
Tormach has done a good job about coolant splash. I did go down to TAP plastics and get a sheet of 1/8 clean vinyl and cover the open area by the headstock. I don't get any on the floor. It's a little drippy when you open up the shield over the cutting area, but they have a drip catcher that bolts to the front of the machine that gets it. I usually don't even open it, I pop tools on the QCTP back at the G30 point and leave the guard down.
There is one caveat and that has to do with zeroing tools. When you start the machine you need to 'ref' the X and Z axis. It does this by micro switches, which I've found to be off by up to .010 from one shutdown to the next startup. Ideally you should be able to adjust this out by re-zeroing on tool 1 by setting the work offsets. I've found the first part has been off on the X axis by as much as 3 to 4 thou, but the following parts come in, after that they are fine. ??? Not quite sure what that's about.
Thanks Adamvs, good stuff. Yeah, I live in the countryside where sound carries. Not sure if running a 20 year old 10,000lb Okuma would go over well....Although it might keep the deer away from my yard-that would be good.
So I'm looking at their website--they don't make it easy to figure out ( I don't really like that kind of selling, just be upfront), but it looks like the lathe does not come with any accessories, i.e., no chuck, no tool post (looks like you need to purchase a separate tool post plate), not even a gang plate. So after buying all that the price goes way up making the $12,200 lathe, after shipping, much more expensive. More like a $14000 to $15000 lathe just to get it running properly. Please correct me if I am wrong anyone.
It will do stainless. I've machined a bit of stainless and a LOT of titanium. Works great!
Quote:
Originally Posted by CNCAuburn
Auburn, Ca? If so, I'm just across the canyon from you in Greenwood. I'm running a 20hp turning center off a 40hp phase converter in my garage. I can hear the buzz of the florescent lights outside but can't hear the machine or phase converter. Go figure.
That's great, I'm about 6 miles outside of Auburn. I might still look at a bigger lathe. Given the price on the Tormach seems to be going up and up the more I look at it, a used gt27 would probably be a good compromise given I can find one for the right price.
Good video Adam - Subscribed
Note: If you plan on running anything with "real chips/strings" then you need to run your tooling upside down- EASY don't think you have to reverse X in code or CAM or anything, can be done in the control for ZERO fuss (have a vid)
However the REF off by .010" doesn't sound right. I ASSUME they use the same tormach PCNC 1100 switches.. which are off by less than .001" UNLESS gunked up. At which case I have a video for the fix :)
+++1. Thanks for posting it.Quote:
Originally Posted by BAMCNC.COM
Looking good!
Nice setup and clean video, Adam.
md
Quote:
Originally Posted by BAMCNC.COM
Yes, .010" sounds way wrong. Could be a flaky switch. I doubt it's gunked up - it's a few moneths old. I've had to clean the Y axis switch on the PCNC 1100 a couple of times. I was watching your videos this morning. Nice! Keep'em coming. I'm going to write a 'warm up' program ( per your video - for both machines - ) which I'm thinking might help.
In my opinion, the proper way to set up homing switches is to have a index flag on the axis screw in series (or parallel depending on the switch configuration) with the slide switch. The slide switch gets you close, the screw switch gets you to the resolution of the stepper or servo encoder.
I suspect one should watch for backlash too. On a new machine, it might be wise to check the screw preload after the machine has been broken-in. Checking the gibs might be wise too.
Kirk, this sounds good. What's available to do this - do you have a link? Can it be adapted to the Tormach?Quote:
Originally Posted by kirk_wallace
Giving this more thought, I may have been a bit hasty with my original comment. I am more of a machine integrator than a machinist and the integrator says, if the machine has an accurate home then upon powering up the machine, and homing it, one can continue cutting a workpiece without setting the workpiece origin. The inner machinist says he wants to set the workpiece origin every time to make sure it is right. I am fairly new to Tormach machines and it seems that setting the workpiece origin is pretty easy. The other use for homing is to set the workspace soft limits. Since there is some space between the soft limits and the firm limits, the slide switches are plenty accurate.
Besides modifying your machine may interfere with getting support. At this point, I would need to study how the lathe is set up to find out how it could be made better, then try to decide if there is a clear advantage to making a change.
I looked for some links, but didn't really find anything. My HNC is based on this:
Homing Configuration
LinuxCNC Documentation Wiki: Homing And Limit Switch
I don't have definitive data, but the few times I've tripped an E-stop mid-job so that the axes had to be re-referenced the new part origin came out very close to the old one - just a few tenths off. Based on that limited data the limit switches seem to work a lot better for me than one might expect.
Mike