IHC Charter Oak 12z conversion (RF-45 variant)

My machine arrived today. I have already converted my G0704 mill using Hoss' plans through phase 1 (i.e stock + steppers) I found the setup to be lacking for machining steel in the way that I do and, well who am I kidding, I could afford a bigger mill and now I'm having at it. It was a bit drizzly today so hauling the crate in my open trailer to my house was concerning. I wasn't entirely sure if my plan to get it into the garage (hermit cave) was going to pan out, but luckily it did.
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My trusty little orange tractor was of great help.
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Fork attachment chained around the crate with the ramps under to support the weight.
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Slid down perfectly.
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I could just barely tip the crate back with the curl cylinder, but that made it easy to move.
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Not sure how I will be able to make room yet.
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Looks like it made it with no damage.

I ordered my machine from charter oak because of the 4 places I emailed to check if they had machines in stock and what the shipping was, they were the only ones that replied. I figure if a business can't find the time to fire off an email to an individual whose money they want, I would have even less chance of getting a reply once they do have my money. FWIW.

My design goals are:
Convert this machine to Mach3 control to make prototype and 1 off steel parts.
Machining IPM up to 10 ipm Rapids <200 ipm
Avoid having to use coolant.
Install economy one shot oiling system. ala cowanrg http://www.cnczone.com/forums/bencht...pm-30mv-4.html
Use Chai's double nut c7 ball screws.
Drive the axis with steppers.
Provide for existing 4th axis or build a new one.

this makes a lot of sense, a new forum with 2 threads about ih/charter oak mills when there ALREADY is an ih/charter oak forum. LOL.

I dunno what to tell you, I thought the charter oak automation support forum was for support. The thread by ahab345009 got moved there and then back here. I hope all of the rf 45 theads strewn throughout get moved here. It's very frustrating trying to find the various builds right now especially since so many machines have different names. Bring on some more builds!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bjones

this makes a lot of sense, a new forum with 2 threads about ih/charter oak mills when there ALREADY is an ih/charter oak forum. LOL.

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Yes, it actually does make a lot of sense. As maker said, the Charter Oak forum is more of a product support forum for Charter Oak's CNC mills, not a forum for RF-45 DIY CNC conversions in general. This sub-forum should be more for the latter. It was only by chance that the first two builds here happened be purchased through Charter Oak. It doesn't make much sense to categorized all these Chinese mills by their importer anyway since there are so many nearly identical models available through different importers. If the Zone were to do it that way there should be a Grizzly forum, a Harbor Freight forum, a Precision Matthews forum, a Bolton Tools forum, etc; but there isn't really, so it doesn't make sense to make all mills imported and purchased through Charter Oak go to a Charter Oak forum. I think it makes much more sense to categorize by the type of mill (RF-45, BF-30, X2, X3, etc). It seems they had already more or less started to do that in the Benchtop Machines forum and this sub-forum simply continues that trend.

Maker, good to see you got your mill in good order.

Man, I need a tractor;)

news flash for you, ih and ih clones are not considered rf45's. rf45 clones are the smaller mills with approx 32x9 inch table sizes. ih mills are not just long table versions of rf45's, they are different in many ways which is why we have the term ih clones to describe them. fyi there are build threads on the ih/co forum that have nothing to do with getting support.

I'm quite aware of the differences which is why I went with the Charter Oak mill in the first place but it is still pretty similar overall. That's why they are usually labeled something like "IH - RF45" like in this thread:
http://www.cnczone.com/forums/bencht...-bearings.html

Or "IH Clone Build (Long Travel RF45)" on this thread:
http://www.cnczone.com/forums/bencht...avel-rf45.html

Or where Bob Warfield calls his mill an RF-45 here:
http://www.cnczone.com/forums/bencht...-45-clone.html

Bob also calls his machine an "Industrial Hobbies RF-45 milling machine" on his page here:
CNC Conversion: RF-45 Milling Machine

Here is a thread about an IH Clone mill where they discuss wanting to have an RF-45 only forum started such as this one. They obviously seem to classify the IH clone as in the same category as other RF-45s.
http://www.cnczone.com/forums/bencht...rsion%20build=

Here is a link to a page where Hoss lists the IH mill as the king of RF-45s on his RF-45 Clone mill page here:
http://www.hossmachine.info/RF-45_Clone.html

I could go on but I have better things to do today. I submit to you that the term "IH clone mill" is a sub-category of "RF-45 clone", not a whole new category. This forum should include all of them.

Also....

I know there are build threads on the Charter Oak forum and mine was moved there after I originally posted it in the Benchtop Machines forum as well. They are probably there because they were moved there too because this forum didn't exist yet. I didn't think it was a good place for my thread for the reasons I've already mentioned so I requested that they make an RF-45 clone forum in order to gather all the relevant builds in the same place. It seems the administrators agreed with me since they started this new forum. I think it will make finding info on RF-45 mill conversions much easier and I'm quite pleased that they did it.

I made the stand yesterday and got it painted during a break in the rain.
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The old "measure twice, cut once" only works if you remember the correct measurement.
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My newish 7x12 bandsaw got a good test cutting all 8 pieces of 3" channel bundled.
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Still cut straight though. Not too bad for a $650 saw with the stock blade.
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I made the stand 28" square and 26" tall not including the leveling feet.
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I made leveling feet from 3/4" bolts and 1/4" thick drops from a laser cutter.
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This is just the sort of project I need the bigger mill for! G0704 turning an 11/16 drill to open up a 1/2" hole at .1 ipm. Without copious amount of cutting oil it would not have made it through.
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On the stand next to the grizzly.

oops looks like something went wrong with the attachments.


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My newish 7x12 bandsaw got a good test cutting all 8 pieces of 3" channel bundled.
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Still cut straight though. Not too bad for a $650 saw with the stock blade.
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I made the stand 28" square and 26" tall not including the leveling feet.
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I made leveling feet from 3/4" bolts and 1/4" thick drops from a laser cutter.
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This is just the sort of project I need the bigger mill for! G0704 turning an 11/16 drill to open up a 1/2" hole at .1 ipm. Without copious amount of cutting oil it would not have made it through.
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On the stand next to the grizzly.

It is a bit hard to show the difference in size of the IH and the G0704. Many people just see the pictures and it is a world of difference.

Having the 704 as a second mill still should save time on some projects, although for the money a used RF-31 is a great second mill and lets you drill in long stock easier than most.

IH was having some problems in the past when Tommy was running the place. It looks like Paul is doing a much better job. Did you get your mill fast?

This shows the size differences pretty well.
Hoss

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e9yEEt4mLMg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by arizonavideo

It looks like Paul is doing a much better job. Did you get your mill fast?

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So far my experience would support that. As I mentioned earlier, Paul was the only of several possible vendors to even answer my inquiry for stock and shipping. He had 1 machine in stock. I paid for it on a Friday morning, and it arrived the following Thursday. I would consider that fast since I didn't even have time to move my junk to make room :)

I'm certainly not giving up the 0704. I'm leaning towards giving it the Hoss' phase2 cnc + belt drive and build an enclosure to set it up for aluminum, in the event that I finish converting the 12z. I've been so busy making parts and now converting another mill (and hopefully my lathe) one of these days I will have to actually learn how to machine!

Hoss' printed mill parts certainly helped visualize the size difference, but nothing like having the darn thing towering over you.
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I'm 5'11 standing at the same focal length as the mill.

Well, I made a little headway. I was able to run a new 240 with neutral to the machine area and connect the motor to verify that it runs. I started on my electronics enclosure as well. I had an old automatic gate operator enclosure that I'm planning to use.
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Just needs a little cleanup and some primer.
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I am going to run the 240 into the cabinet for all 240 and 120v service. There should be plenty of room for a CPU, breakout board, drivers, power supply and room to spare if I eventually go with a vfd. I started making cutouts in the side where I will have a vent and the panel that will have motor outputs etc.

I want to make a control panel this time and mount it to a robust swinging arm. This would go on the opposite side of the enclosure from the motor plugs.

I saved up enough for the next phase, ordering the ball screws. I took measurements from the machine (with a tape measure) and tried to find any other 45 conversions that listed what they used to create my plan. 25mm screws for all 3 axis is my thinking. The current screws are 1" so I know the 25mm will fit. I have my g0704 and access to 2 bridgeports for the saddle machining and any mods needed for the ball nuts. I have 7202B ac bearing pairs for one end of all 3 axis. Y and Z will be unsupported opposite and x will have 1 6202zz and optional snap ring. I am custom making all new end plates which I plan to secure with at least 4 screws like an industrial machine so I can align the end plate to the ball nut to prevent binding. I have drawn ends of the shafts 1/2 for easy fitting of coupler or pulley.
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Warning, these drawings have not been tested on any of the machines listed. You are welcome to use, but do so at your own risk. I plan to update and repost once I have actually finished install with any changes plus end plates.

Wow the preview for .pdf on this forum is terrible!

You really can't go by the 1" lead screws because the nuts have a smaller OD then a 25mm ball screw nut. To fit the 25mm nuts on the x and y you will have to machine or grind the saddle and table castings some. I have used 20mm on the X and y with minor machining of the castings and 25 mm on the Z. I see no benefit for the larger screw on the X and Y. Just my opinion.

I appreciate the input. Looks like you have converted a couple machines in this class. No problems with the 20mm screw flexing on the x axis on your md001?

No, flex is none issue. I don't have the Y axis supported on the end opposite the drive, just because of the short distance and lac of good mounting surface. Works just fine. The X axis is supported by bearing on end opposite drive. All ball screws have double nuts.