Servo setup and troubleshooting (Samsung CSDJ Plus 02BX2 - CSM 02BB)

Hi all,

My DIY CNC router is mecanicaly operational. I'm just waiting to last belt to come.
Everything is wired and powered. Checked and re-checked. Not so bad, I guess, for an absolute beginer.
Last step (but not least) is to configure the servo drives and motors, Mach3 setup, and surely some tests and fine tuning.

For people not familiar with Samsung drives and servos, it's 230v AC servo+drives 200w.
They carry a 9 wires 2048 steps encoder.

So I started the Drive configuration, but I had some trouble.
The regular procedure is to configure the drives first vith the SmartJog V4 software.
Bad news, there's a connexion error between the soft and the drives. ("The drive did not awnser
The link is thru COM1. The parameters of the COM port are well configured. I checked each wire of the COM cable, and the cable is ok.
There's no COM1 errors on the window's Device Manager pannel.
I tried also to unplug the driver connexions (CN1 & CN2), but the soft still cannot access the drive.

Do anybody have an idea or some skills on that hardware ?

I'm still trying to make all that work, without success at this time...
Another question : in the manual, an auxiliary capacitor can be mounted on P and N outlets.
Maybe I misenderstood, i think it's necessary when a brake is mounted.
As far I do not have any brake, must I mount an auxiliary capacitor anyways ?
If yes, what should be that capacitor's voltage and capacitance ?

I can't find any details on the CSDJ Plus User's manual...

Attachment 249872

No progress. I tried to operate one sigle driver at a time, without any other device working.
The indicator is still fastly blinking red/green, and no connexion is possible with SmartJog. :/

To the 60 readers, I appreciate you don't know how to help. Thx, I feel a bit less lonely.

what version of smartjog are you using?
does it have the model of your servo drive in the options?
another post suggests using an older software version if your drive model isnt listed.

have you tried com2?
you can use a serial port loopback and terminal to make sure you are connecting to the correct physical port, and that communication is exiting the computer.

that's all I have to offer.

Thankfully my delta servo drives had no problem communicating through the usb port on the drive.

Many thanks for your awnser Alan, 3 days i'm on this problem and I felt so lonely !

I use SmartJog v4.0.0.4 (the last update as far as I know...) and the CSDJ plus is included.
I can load the CSDJ template, but I can't connect the driver.
Unfortunately, the Lenovo computer dedicated for the CNC only owns one COM port.
Anyway you're idea is good : maybe it's a computer problem and I focus on the drive and cables.
I don't have a null modem cable, but I'll try to do something with jumpers.
Attachment 249886 or Attachment 249888
I will try with another computer too.

Thanks again Alan ;)

As i see on manual u gave ( page 253), there should be only 3 wire connection with PC 2-3, 3-2 and 5-5 no other wires are needed (shield if longer cable and only on one side)
Try and connect 1-4-6 and 7-8 on PC side only ..

Go into control panel and into com ports COM1 tenn properties-port settings (do restore defaults here)-advance (check FIFO) and maximize the bars at last here u try to change COM port to next possible higher number (COM3)
Also u may check in bios are ur ports enabled :D

BTW nice thing u got going there ... If i get this right u will set this drives in Stepper control and it is much much better to have these AC drives with feedback in stepper control then with stepper motors without feedback...

I have done similar setup with older Indramat (now Bosch/Rexroth) EcoDrive DKC 3.1 but it was for spring machine and it works perfectly :D this should do the same..

So, the COM1 port is ok, it had to be checked before any further step !

Thanks CroCole for your message. You are absolutely right ! I need to build a custom cable.
It cannot work properly with my standard cable because of the 2-3 pins swap.
I should have noticed that !
Maybe it's the key ! I'll try this tomorrow morning with hope.

Many thanks !

Zavashier

Don't add a auxiliary capacitor, you most likely will get a big surprise if you do, I think what you are talking about is a Braking Resistor, you don't need this for normal operation

Zavashier

I checked the manual P B is were you would add a Braking Resistor if there was a need , not capacitor needed for your P N

Thank you for your messages Mactec54. You confirmed what I thought : no brake = no resistor/capacitor.

Unable to whait, last night I made a custom cable (tested and OK).
It's surely solves a problem, but I still can't manage to etablish a connexion..

I forget to say that I have the same problem whatever drive/motor is in use.
I could have a driver in fault, but certainly not 3 of them.
I think there's 3 possible reasons to fail : a wrong procedure, a computer problem, some cable problem.
Today I try to connect with another computer.
I will also check again (maybe make temporary new cables) the drive/motor/encoder connexions.

Quick questions...
Did u do the right Com setup in your program?
Have u tried to shortwire 1-4-6 and 7-8 on PC side ??

Attachment 249972

Zavashier

Do you have the 24vdc power supply connected, nothing will happen without this connected, 5v dc may be enough to get you running

Hi all, thanks for your messages !

@Mactec54, yes there's a 24v running thru CN3 port (50 pin connector).
@CroCole, yes the cable's requiered pins are shortwire.

Here's a video of my last test (please excuse my heavy accent) :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UlvK...ature=youtu.be

Zavashier

Unplug the CN1 from the drive & try to get your software & cable working, once you have this working, then you will be able to see what alarm is triggered, Red /Green flashing means your have an alarm, buy the correct cable if you have to, it needs to be shielded twisted pair, CN1 cable also needs to be Shielded twisted pair

Try Look Rs232 ... is drive giving any answer

Hi all; thanks for your help !

The drive is less than 8" away from the driver and the risk of interference is extremely low. If I get positioning errors, I'll go for a Shielded twisted pair cable.
Actualy I use some very high quality teflon and O2 free copper cables which overtake the Samsung's cable quality.
Otherhand, I need to make my own cables for CN1, because the breakout board I use is realy basic and have no MDR connector.
The encoder cable I wired is also a high quality one, shielded of course, and I succesfully checked the connections from start to end.
Throught, RS-Automation can't sell the needed cables in France, because the CSDJ drivers and CMD servos are not sold in Europe. They will also provide no support. Fine...

So, I ordered two new connectors (CN1+CN2) and put one drive, one motor+encoder, and the breakout bord out of the bay.
I hope this will be easyer to find what's wrong with a basic configuration.

I've read the CSDJ+ user's manual again. I still try to find what I did wrong. And I found something.
Attachment 250232
The pins 1-4-7-8's function of the communication cable are "ground".
From the CON.B (Driver side) I tryed to wire them together and connected them to the shield of the driver.
And the alarm stopped ! BUT... The led is now red (continuous) and not orange as it should be.

Q1/ It looks like that ground/shield have an importance into cable wiring, even if the pins are labeled "N.C" (for Not Connected ?)
What's your opinon on wiring these pins to ground or shied ?

So I started to think that the wiring instructions of the seller might be verified.
The connection scheme provided in the kit is the folowing.
Attachment 250234
Note the +24vDC is connected to pin 1 and ground to pins 3-4-5-12-14.
In the manual; I found the explaination of power on pin 1 :
Attachment 250236
BUT... in the section 3.2 of the manual says the 24v must be connected to pins 45-46.
Attachment 250238
The same informations are reported for the multi drive wiring instructions in chapter 3.6 :
Attachment 250240
If it's true, the wiring instructions of the seller are wrong, and may be the cause of the encounted problems !
So I've read the I/O specifications of CN1 (2.16) to find an awnser, but i'm not sure anymore.
Attachment 250242

Q21/ Pins 45 and 46 have something to do wiht the alarm, that's a point. It's SALM+ for pin 45 and SALM- for pin 46.
If I follow the instructions of the Samsung manual, I should connect the 45 pin with +24vDC and pin 46 with the breakout board's ground.
Am-I right ? No matter with the +24vDC on pin 1 simultaneously ?

Q3/ On the I/O specifications, Pin 2 should recieve also +24vDC. Should-I reconsider totaly the wiring instructions of the seller ?
In this case, what would be the wiring of the CN1 Connector ? (appreciate my breakout board cannot recieve alarm/errors instructions)

Thanks again to help a servo newbie ;)

Hey...
As i see 45 & 46 are alarm output... and it should turn your relay (what u use for stoping the machine because the drive is in error... ) u have input alarm reset it is number 7 ... check the manual how u shoul wire that.


But have to start from begining...
Take the drive out from machine and just plug the 24V dc input via automatic fuse 1 or 2A to the drive... Does it work? It should... Then without anything drive is in error but that is ok because no motor no anything.... Then u should try communication with the drive to input all parameters and see drive problems.. After u get communication then u can plug motor and encoder... And when drive is ok then u can plug it in machine....

Are u shure ur computer com is ok? Try on other older pc...

Are u shure ur cable is ok? Give pictures of both side open...
Check the drive maybe wire 1 is on other side of connector.

Can u open the plastic cover from front of drive and see inside what is pin 1 on connector...

My bad u only need to connect MAIN L1 and L2 power only it is sufficient for drive operation...
So for my earlier post use only MAIN L1 and L2 power input via fuse and try to get the communication... . (nothing else needs to be connected)

As u can see on the picture the 24 V DC are only for input and outputs...
Attachment 250282
Left side are inputs to the drive... Right side are outputs...
The tricky part is that Inputs are controlled with 0V DC and have COMMON +24VDC (in Europe we mostly have 0V COMMON wire and we command with +24V DC )
So u need only to connect +24V DC to pin 1 .... (it would be advised that the 0V DC from yours converter is connected to the ground PE of the machine so if there is any short circuit the fuse from yours +24V DC converter will trip)

You command the drive with 0V signal from yours +24V DC converter to the inputs pins 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 and 15... (10-15 are defined with the parameters)
So the command to release drive and make it work is with 0V signal and on your board that u shown is made for this.. (I would connect only 3,4,5,14 with 0VDC from your board (do not understand the pin 12 as it is output, 14 is ground for that output... ) Inputs 3,4,5 meaning-- Servo ON, FOW and BACK release and are sufficient to run drive.... )
The moving command for your drive is via wires 11 and 13 as yours picture shows.. But that is the last u connect...

But before all that u need to config the drive/s and motor/s on table and get it work.. ( if u connect all then it could be hard to find the error)
PRIORITY::::Get the communication with program... Input motor and encoder parameters.. Connect motor and encoder... Check for errors eliminate them ... Then do the auto tune procedure.. U may have to connect +24V DC supply to pin 1 and connect the 3,4,5 with 0VDC to enable the drive so it can do autotune and later u may need it to do the jog via program.. Finally test the drive, motor and encoder from Program JOG MODE ( jog mod on -- jog up jog down) .. When u get that then u can place only the drive in machine and try to move motors via MACH3 and when u get that then put the motors on the machine and do auto tune in middle positions for all axis to compensate the load inertia..
( i have downloaded SmartJog version 3 and it is really nice looking program ..)

Hello again :D
About the communication....
Beware of the male female pin out
Attachment 250296
So on my similar communication cable i have and use for communication with similar drives i dismantle him and on PC side 2 is white (RX), 3 is brown (TX), 5 is black (GND) , 4 connected to 6 (Data terminal ready to Data set ready), and 7 connected to 8 (Request to send to Clear to send)
on DRIVE side i have RX (2) is brown, TX (3) is white and (5) GND is black...

Pc cable side should be good then u can try to get communication working...

Try 2-3 3-2 then 2-2 3-3 then if that does not work i would try to connect parallel wire form CN3 pin 5 to any other ground on CN3 (pin 1 or 4 or 6 or 7 or 8 ) (That could be the trick that the drive does not have GND (ground) potential for communication...First try connect CN3 pin 1 to pin 5 as i found in similar manual that is how they wire drive side - page 274... http://www.famotor.com/data/samsung/..._Manual_kor_v1[1].0.pdf )

Attachment 250300

Then try 2-3 3-2 then 2-2 3-3 and if that does not work then try removing wire from pin 5 from drive just to have ground pin 1 or 4 or 6 or 7 or 8 connected
Then try 2-3 3-2 then 2-2 3-3

Hope u will get it working because only other way is to use operator panel to input parameters...

Hi Crocole, thanks for your message and the link ;)

For the communication cable, here's how I proceed. Fist, I was unable to use the two DB9 connectors provided in the kit.
The female on had missing pins that makes it totaly useless :(
So I decided to breake a standard Com cable and just wire the male DB9 at the output :
Attachment 250320
I'm an absolute beginer with servos but I learned wiring during my Master in Acoustic Studies, a long time ago.
Anyway, I can still make mistakes.
The trick I use to properly number the pins is to put male an female connectors face to face.
Male pin 5 comes into female pin 5, as simple as that. As the female connector is fused I was not able to read the numbers.
But all the pins are numbered on the male connector. Easy enough, even for a guy like me ;)
That's how I wired the CN3 communication cable :
Attachment 250322
Of course, I check the cable before to install it. Just to avoid porblems as much as possible !
Attachment 250324
All my wiring is checked. I'm a maniac with that, because in my job 90% of breakdowns come from cables or connectors.

By the past, I had problems with devices because of a to low signal to trigg-up the device.
So I decided to aslo check the 230v AC and the 24v DC. It's not stupid to check, especialy when you use a filter, as recommanded.
Attachment 250326
229V, not so bad. Prety enough to make the driver works.
I checked again the CN2 cable, each pin.
Attachment 250328
Then I adjusted the DC power supply to get 24.1v at the input of the driver (no measurable looses by the short cable).
Attachment 250330
I'm now sure there's no problem from that.

Then, listening to CroCole's advoices, I brought back most of the computers I own, especialy the old ones.
The Renovo Think Centre Dedicated to the CNC is not brand new or hi-end, it's a reclaimed one.
Anyway, CroCole is right, jt's no time to trust it any more.
And with the first "fresh" computer connected, I get in, with the installed v4.0.0.4 of SmartJog ! Good news !

I did not have enough time to go any further, but there's the informations I can give at this point :
- when alarm is reseted, the drive comes again in alarm mode
- one signgle alarm code : E36 (Encoder type Missmatch)
- the internal firmare is 1.2 (before 2004 (1.6) ! the last one is 2.30 (2008).

Feel free to comment these informations. ;)