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IndustryArena Forum > MetalWorking Machines > Benchtop Machines > Enco square column (RF-45 clone) CNC build.
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  1. #1
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    Aug 2004
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    Enco square column (RF-45 clone) CNC build.

    Well let’s see. It’s been since 2005 (when I bought the mill) that I have worked on it. Actually some work in 2006 too.
    I bought the mill new from Enco in 2005. Free shipping and at a deep discount during their 20% off sale. I originally bought it to use as a drill press for the most part and NOT to convert to CNC. I already had too many projects and this was not supposed to be one more. But as is usual for me it turned into a project.

    I looked high and low, did a lot of reading and decided to swap the cranks for motors and do a full on CNC conversion. I saw some great machines out there, there were not as many builds as there are now and sure enough got the bug!!!

    I need to preface. This might be considered an Industrial Hobbies build but I think I’ll keep it here because when I started it there was no sub forum for the IH machines. AND. I don’t have an IHs machine so it might not fit in. I spoke with Aaron Moss many times over a year and gained some great knowledge before he changed professions. IMO, great guy.

    I bought his conversion kit in 2005 also. It was a well-planned kit he sold and fit within my budget.

    So now fast forward to now (2013) and I’m getting back to the build. I dropped the ball somewhere around 2007 when I was involved with an even longer (1995) car project. The car had some money in it and I needed to secure the car so it would not just be left by the wayside. The car is not done but road ready. I can drive it so off to the races I go. NO!! Not car races, I don’t race cars The CNC conversion race to get her done and making chips before I move on to the other project in my home garage.

    So here we go folks. It might seem like it’s all over the place. The reason why is I actually did some work in 2005 and 2006 so I want to show some old stuff along with the new stuff at the same time. In the end I hope to show the entire process.

    It will be a picture loaded build cause I personally love the pics you guys post and I think most folks like a pic story along with my seemingly never ending talk LOL Yeah, I’m kinda wordy. Hope them dog gone moderators don’t shut me down fer talking too much.

    First pic. The day the mill arrived. Again, free shipping. I think I paid 1700 bucks for it. I have the receipt, I should make sure. That’s oiled paper on the table and machined surfaces. Didn’t help, there was rust. I’ll show that and how easily it came off.


    Lifting the mill onto my work table. That lil slug was heavy. I had to modify my engine lift (cherry picker with bags of rock) to get the reach I needed.


    Here is a shot of the IHs stuff. Nice stuff..


    (Note: The opinions expressed in this post are my own and are not necessarily those of CNCzone and its management)

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
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    117
    Those were pics from 2005. Fast forward to now and I have a Hoffman electrical box I will use for the electrics.


    It’s a nice 24"x 24"x 8" box with a sub panel for mounting the goods.


    It was a used box that had a lot of plastic anchors attached. They were not easy to remove. I decided to chisel them off. I used an air hammer with a bit that I ground sharp. It removed all of them (about 50) in a minute.


    Next was lining up the parts that I wanted to use and see what was gonna be the best arrangement. That's still going on.


    This last week I did buy some electronics. I bought some electronics back in 2006 from CNC4PC. A breakout board, power supply, relay board and a dump board. MAN!! Have they come a long way. I should show a pic or two of the old stuff. It’s?? Umm? Old is all.
    I ended up going with a Warp9 Ethernet Smooth Stepper (aka ESS) and a PMDX-126 breakout board. I think it’s the best setup for Mach.


    So anyway. Much more to come. YES!! The hardware is in place on the mill (happened in 2005-2006) and I’ll show all the pics I have.

    For now that’s it. Waiting on parts for the control cabinet. JR
    (Note: The opinions expressed in this post are my own and are not necessarily those of CNCzone and its management)

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
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    210
    That is a big pile of parts. I love it when you can start on a project like this and not have to scour the internet for parts along the way. Those are some pretty awesome looking X/Y servos. What is the story on those?

  4. #4
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    Apr 2005
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    1268
    Wow, you've spent a long time on this conversion! But not to worry! In this arena, "Home CNC" that is, well, I've found it's a job that never ends!!!! Always a mod or repair needed so take your time!
    Gonna be a nice machine though. I also opted to change my system to PMDX and Smoothstepper. Never looked back.
    Nice pix and keep them coming.
    Bill
    billyjack
    Helicopter def. = Bunch of spare parts flying in close formation! USAF 1974 ;>)

  5. #5
    Might be the longest build on record here on the zone.
    Keep at it, looking forward to your progress.
    Hoss
    http://www.hossmachine.info - Gosh, you've... really got some nice toys here. - Roy Batty -- http://www.g0704.com - http://www.bf20.com - http://www.g0602.com

  6. #6
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    Aug 2004
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    Quote Originally Posted by Winnfield View Post
    That is a big pile of parts. I love it when you can start on a project like this and not have to scour the internet for parts along the way. Those are some pretty awesome looking X/Y servos. What is the story on those?
    The motors are what Industrial Hobbies sold when Aaron was the owner. They are some decent, if not pricey Pittman NEMA 23 motors. The heat sink is what Aaron came up with and its not unlike what is on my Bridgeport for the steppers.

    And yes. A 23 nema motor does sound a lil small for the 45 table but its not. Remember the nema number is for several dimensions one being the face mounting size. So yes. Its a 23 but its also pretty long for a 23. And with the gearing its plenty of power to drive the table and if inclined break a 1/2" end mill if the situation pops up. JR
    (Note: The opinions expressed in this post are my own and are not necessarily those of CNCzone and its management)

  7. #7
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    Oct 2006
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    210
    The heat sinks are awesome. I have seen those on the stumpy-looking servos on knee mills in the past. Neat. Someone should bring those back. Super cool.

    That is going to be one nice looking machine. The color is perfect, and it looks like you got a high quality version. I can't wait to see it finished.

  8. #8
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    Aug 2004
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    Quote Originally Posted by bill south View Post
    Wow, you've spent a long time on this conversion! But not to worry! In this arena, "Home CNC" that is, well, I've found it's a job that never ends!!!! Always a mod or repair needed so take your time!
    Gonna be a nice machine though. I also opted to change my system to PMDX and Smoothstepper. Never looked back.
    Nice pix and keep them coming.
    Bill
    You are correct Bill. Home CNC is ALL Im about. I also get the folks that have to get things up and running. Me? No hurry, so it seems. Hmm? The PMDX and ESS? I think its the best interface for Mach at this point.

    BUT?? I also think Mach with the simplest of breakout boards and a parallel cable running from the computer ALSO works just fine for many systems. Many systems. After all, thats what Mach was supposed to be. And inexpensive solution for folks wanting to get into the CNC part of their craft. Wood, plastic or metal. So with that I say anyone wanting to mess with CNC controls should NOT be intimidated with ALL the advances re: various interfaces. A simple parallel cable (printer cable) and a basic breakout board can control ANY 3 axis machine. I love the sport of electronics and metal working. Thanks to the folks out there, now we can play with our machines. JR
    (Note: The opinions expressed in this post are my own and are not necessarily those of CNCzone and its management)

  9. #9
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    Sep 2005
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    1195
    A simple parallel cable (printer cable) and a basic breakout board can control ANY 3 axis machine.
    Do you plan to use ESS and VFD using basic board?

  10. #10
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    Dec 2006
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    839
    Those Pittman motors are way more powerful than one would expect, they would run the mill fine. Its a shame we lost Aaron as the owner of IH, IMHO the people lost a lot of what Aaron was trying to do for them when IH was sold. Its my understanding the company has again been sold, hopefully they will bring the company back to a level more in line with what it was when Aaron was running it.


    I have this exact mill, mine was built in 2001 (same color also). I have been pleased with mine all though a little trouble with the Z axis. The motor on mine has held up great, in fact I feel like it may be a little better than most Asian motors that come with many of the mills these days. Both power and durability have been very good with it. On the Z axis the dovetails have spread a bit at the bottom of the travel ( casting seasoning maybe?). Its not bad, but something has moved in the casting to cause it and it gets tight at the bottom of the travel.

    One problem I did have was every bearing in the head that was above the oil line died with in hours of breaking in. They had drawn moisture and rusted. Mine set in storage for many years also so this may have been the reason.

    I think the Y axis nut mount will be different than the mount supplied by Aaron, and maybe even the X axis. The Z axis mod Aaron outlined to fix slop in the will need to be dune the same as the IH mill (maybe some small differences).


    Also every gib in the machine may really need help. They looked like you took a grinder to them on mine, but after making them flat/fit the machine worked so much better. Movement, accuracy and slop where all improved a great deal and the machine has shown no signs of wear in a few years of use. No lapping/scraping on the dovetails, just the work done on the gibs.

    Over all I feel these are good castings/machines to start with. Maybe no better than others, but certainly no worse. BTW be careful when moving the head around, they use filler to smooth the sides of the head before painting. It will chip and come out in chucks if you let something dig into it. The paint has held up very good on mine (where I didn't crack the filler) so if you can keep from chipping when doing the CNC mods it will be worth being careful with the painted surfaces.

    IDK if your going to go with ball screws, if not the factory nuts and end mounts are possibly the worst part of this machine. New nuts and end bearings would fix this, but with Aarons kit you will at least have the end bearings covered. The factory nuts do have backlash adjustment, but it leaves it to stiff for hand cranks, but may work ok with the servos. Ball screws would be best.

    Jess
    GOD Bless, and prayers for all.

  11. #11
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    0
    Hey Jess, you don't happen to still have your factory leadscrews and nuts do you? You aren't kidding about the factory nuts being bad, my x-axis is completely gone, and the y isn't feeling good anymore either.

    JR is going to see if he still has his, but I wouldn't mind ending up with 2 sets if it comes to that. I'm still not convinced I want to CNC my mill...

    BTW, I would have PMed this message, but your inbox is full
    Chasing tenths is hard...

  12. #12
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    Aug 2004
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    Quote Originally Posted by hoss2006 View Post
    Might be the longest build on record here on the zone.
    Keep at it, looking forward to your progress.
    Hoss
    Hahaha. I know right Hoss. But keeping it real there are some other folks that have stayed on task and built some amazing machines in much less time. Umm? YES!! You for one. You already know Im a fan of your work so thanks for looking. JR
    (Note: The opinions expressed in this post are my own and are not necessarily those of CNCzone and its management)

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
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    839
    1HobbyMachinist

    I do still have them, but I plan to use them on a project where I just need screws that will work and there accuracy and smoothness will not really matter.


    Have you tried to adjust the backlash adjuster on them? They are easy to adjust, it just takes a Allen wrench . I have seen the Y axis nut just simply get loose where it only uses one bolt. But even adjusted up good they don't work very well. On my X axis though I was able to get good performance from them once my gib was fitted to the dovetails better, and I had the end bearing slack taken care of. The handwheels are also such a joke I took the handle off and drilled the end of it so that two small bearings would fit in the end of it. This made it so when I turned the handle on the handwheel the handle was really running on bearings. IDK if that makes any sense to you, if you need I could post a pic of it with my phone.


    IMHO if you are going to try and still run the factory screws I would make some new nuts for them. I would also build a mount for the nut to bolt to instead of the nut itself bolting down. If you have not seen it done I can find a link to show how to make some nice ones out of Delrin or even Teflon. You basically melt the Delrin nut to the screw and it forms the best looking threads you could have. Plus it about always will have very low backlash. It would be pretty easy to do as long as you have a boring head for your mill, or a lathe.

    You would build the nut mount just like one for a flange type ball nut, then the nut would look like a flanged ball nut also so that you could bolt it to the mount with its flange. You make the hole for the threads a little small just like you was going to thread it. But then you slice it in half, put it around the screw, then take a hair blow drier to melt it to the screw. It even welds itself back into one piece, you would just back the screw out and then bolt it into the new mount and you have a nut that doesn't need lube, or adjusting for close to zero backlash.

    Here is a link to a thread at HSM where they show making some nuts this way, all though there not adding a flange for bolting.

    Making Acetal leadscrew nuts the easy way

    Jess
    GOD Bless, and prayers for all.

  14. #14
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    Aug 2004
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    117
    Quote Originally Posted by asuratman View Post
    Do you plan to use ESS and VFD using basic board?
    Hi asuratman. I do intend to use an A/C drive (VFD) on my mill. Id rather use a D/C motor but the cost is out of my range. And besides that I seemed to have accumulated three nice A/C drives that should work very nicely with this mill.

    I wont be using a basic breakout board. I can see the confusion I set up talking about how they can be used. Im using a PMDX board that is far from basic. Its a nice board.

    WAIT a second! My bust!! You prolly asked the perfect question. And to answer it would be YES.

    I misinterpreted your question. The ESS is a three port board and the PMDX is a two port board. So yes Sir. I will use a basic board for the third port off the ESS to control the VFD. Im solly to have missed your point.

    Lemme talk about the boards. And Im no expert, just thinking. The ESS is a computer for the most part. It allows the software (Mach) to dole out commands freely without the overhead. It can spit out step and direction sigs as fast as it wants (which is pretty darn fast even with a slow computer) without worrying about the timing. The ESS board takes the dump from Mach and processes it timing wise so Mach doesnt have to drip feed. Then Mach can send sigs for other events as it sits idle.

    IMO its a very strong board and the USB version was getting there but with the Ethernet board it takes the troubles of the USB path out of the mix. USB is still a master computer hog. Where Ethernet is not. Ethernet will send a stream of data to the ESS board and branch it off into three ports. Its a slave computer in a way.

    The PMDX is very ESS complient. They actually have three mounting holes on the board so the ESS can be firmly mounted to it with standoffs. I will use 1" standoffs. Two header cables will fit right under the ESS and plug right into the PMDX.

    So NOW!! My short sightedness. You asked about the VFD and a basic breakout board. You are correct. There is a third port off the ESS that could be used for a MPG (manual pulse generator) or to control a VFD.

    So to answer your question, YES. I will include a "basic" board to break out the third port from the ESS to drive "other" activities which may include a VFD or a beer pouring machine Its still in the air which one is more important but with three ports I have enough to go around.

    Thank you Sir for getting involved in the build. Good to hear from folks out of the US. Love the input. JR

    OH!! The VFDs or A/C drives I found in my garage.

    Nice units even though they are old. They are new in box units. 5hp (3.7kW boxes). Two Yaskawa V1000 drives and one Hitachi SJ200. Not the newest and greatest but doable for a 2hp three phase spindle motor I'm hoping. Still would like to go with D/C though

    (Note: The opinions expressed in this post are my own and are not necessarily those of CNCzone and its management)

  15. #15
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    Aug 2004
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    117
    Quote Originally Posted by LUCKY13 View Post
    Those Pittman motors are way more powerful than one would expect, they would run the mill fine. Its a shame we lost Aaron as the owner of IH, IMHO the people lost a lot of what Aaron was trying to do for them when IH was sold. Its my understanding the company has again been sold, hopefully they will bring the company back to a level more in line with what it was when Aaron was running it.


    I have this exact mill, mine was built in 2001 (same color also). I have been pleased with mine all though a little trouble with the Z axis. The motor on mine has held up great, in fact I feel like it may be a little better than most Asian motors that come with many of the mills these days. Both power and durability have been very good with it. On the Z axis the dovetails have spread a bit at the bottom of the travel ( casting seasoning maybe?). Its not bad, but something has moved in the casting to cause it and it gets tight at the bottom of the travel.

    One problem I did have was every bearing in the head that was above the oil line died with in hours of breaking in. They had drawn moisture and rusted. Mine set in storage for many years also so this may have been the reason.

    I think the Y axis nut mount will be different than the mount supplied by Aaron, and maybe even the X axis. The Z axis mod Aaron outlined to fix slop in the will need to be dune the same as the IH mill (maybe some small differences).


    Also every gib in the machine may really need help. They looked like you took a grinder to them on mine, but after making them flat/fit the machine worked so much better. Movement, accuracy and slop where all improved a great deal and the machine has shown no signs of wear in a few years of use. No lapping/scraping on the dovetails, just the work done on the gibs.

    Over all I feel these are good castings/machines to start with. Maybe no better than others, but certainly no worse. BTW be careful when moving the head around, they use filler to smooth the sides of the head before painting. It will chip and come out in chucks if you let something dig into it. The paint has held up very good on mine (where I didn't crack the filler) so if you can keep from chipping when doing the CNC mods it will be worth being careful with the painted surfaces.

    IDK if your going to go with ball screws, if not the factory nuts and end mounts are possibly the worst part of this machine. New nuts and end bearings would fix this, but with Aarons kit you will at least have the end bearings covered. The factory nuts do have backlash adjustment, but it leaves it to stiff for hand cranks, but may work ok with the servos. Ball screws would be best.

    Jess
    Hey Jess. I don't normally "quote" an entire post but I couldn't find a place to cut your reply. I agree 100%

    I bought one of Aaron's first RF-45 kits (full three axis, servo, ballscrew encoder unit). I talked with him for hours on end. We have similar backgrounds. I enjoyed our convos till he sold the shop and went to work for TCI. Did the BIG move. Yup, Moss TCI Haha. Never woulda known it. Dude was down to Earth. JR
    (Note: The opinions expressed in this post are my own and are not necessarily those of CNCzone and its management)

  16. #16
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    LUCKY13, I have adjusted the backlash in the past, and continue to do so. The problem is the nut for the x-axis nearly completely wore out to the point that there were hardly any threads left inside of it. I've got a lot of miles on this mill
    Perhaps if you only need the screws, you'd be willing to part with the nuts? No big deal in any case, I've been getting by with doing all my machining in the y-axis lately, it's frustrating, but I'm still making chips.

    I saw that thread on the acetyl nuts, and may go that route later. Right now I just need to get my mill running again so I can get some work done.

    Thanks
    Chasing tenths is hard...

  17. #17
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    DT
    Chasing tenths is hard...

  18. #18
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    Ok... Back to my old build. What was the last pic? Oh yeah. Lifting the mill onto my bench.

    After the lift I took many pics of the mill so I could go back and see how it was assembled before I took the next step which was a complete tear down. For me it was a hard thing to do. A brand new mill that was good to go to do some milling. Kinda like buying a new car and ripping it apart like some shows on TV do. Well? Im not a TV show with massive amounts of money so to basically break a machine is the last thing I wanted to do. It was necessary. ALL the drive screws and nuts, all the crank handles and mounts and the quill feed parts. All stuff I paid for that needed to be removed.

    Comes down to the table, saddle, bottom cast frame and the vertical cast column with the Z axis and gear head. The geared head will be gutted and I will use a belt drive with an A/C or D/C spindle motor. I have a 30 taper spindle I got from Aaron. But?? I am thinking I might not use it. I think I want to make a spindle for the mill and use some of the tooling I have. Too much tooling..

    I have seen some of the vids for the tormach tooling system and love the way it works. And its not overly pricey. But there are some properties I dont like about it. Mainly that its still a draw bar system that works though the R8 taper.

    The head on my machine will be a fixed quill, belt driven spindle and not ATC capable. FYI? Look at some of the TTS vids. They will make you want that system. I do. But it is not part of my plan.

    Tear down....

    All the red grease.








    Rust.













    (Note: The opinions expressed in this post are my own and are not necessarily those of CNCzone and its management)

  19. #19
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    Aug 2004
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    117
    Next? The lapping procedure. I know, I know I know!!! WTF is this all about? Is it a premature wearing of the slides, waste of time, destructive, a good thing, needed ? Is it a "hack" way to fix a problem? Is it destructive and a bad idea?

    I dont know the answer to any of the questions. Not the point for showing it. I did it and the why is not gonna happen here so much. Those answers can take place somewhere else. This is MY post and I did it. Nuff said.

    Here are the pics with some comments from me.

    Starts with this. Some nice grit from Aaron.


    Some oiling up and go to town.


    Second stroke.



    And it continues.



    New fluid is a must along with clean wipes. Use a roll of paper towels, its prolly less than a buck.



    Proper blocking of the parts.



    Plenty of lube. I used WD cause its cheap and I didnt mind the waste.



    Might find some metal inclusions. If you see a spot on yer slide like this dont get too dramatic. Its a small spot.





    Final. Looking good.





    More to come folks. JR
    (Note: The opinions expressed in this post are my own and are not necessarily those of CNCzone and its management)

  20. #20
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    Aug 2004
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    Ok, what was next.... The oil grooves on the slides.

    Not really sure if it was a needed process but while I had it apart that WAS the time to get it done. I have grooved bronze bushings for oiling before and it worked out pretty well so why not.

    I kept it simple. Set up the saddle and Z slide on my Bridgeport along with an 1/8" carbide four flute ball end mill. The machine is CNC but I just used it like a conventional mill with the CNC being a DRO and power feed.

    The Z was easy, the part where I was gonna port it out for the fittings. The saddle needed a lil more planning for the ports. Now whats funny about long term projects is I forget where I ported the grooves out on the saddle I know I bored down into the ways for porting. And connected the bore to a location on the outside of the saddle but forgot where I located the holes... ERRR!! I gotta go look, its buggin me....

    FOUND EM!! The ports for the saddle to base are on the end of the saddle and they are threaded for fittings. The ports for the saddle to table are a lil odd. They are both on the backside of the saddle. They are both in the same spot just opposite sides. That is where it gets weird. How is the forward way area ported from the back of the saddle? Well, it does explain a pic I found and couldn't remember what it was for. Ill post that pic too.

    It was a pic of a part being turned on my lathe. Basically a screw from 1" bar. It was the back Gib locating screw. There are two screws for the gib, one in front as you face the machine and one at the rear. Push-push type situation for the gib. I replaced the rear screw with one I turned. The screw I made was drilled all the way through for the oil passage. Then the head of the screw was drilled (larger than the oil passage) and tapped for an 1/8" NPT fitting. The head face was slotted for a screwdriver (just like the original front one) to adjust the gib.

    So evidently I am running oil through the rear gib screw to the vertical bore on the saddle that will feed oil to the oil groove. What an odd way to do it. But in my defense back in the early part of 2005 there were NO RF-45 conversions going on here. I had to run by the skin (some call it plaque LOL) of my teeth.

    Im not a machinist, not educated for much to be honest so sometimes its just a matter of finding my way through the dark with a very dim flashlight. It may or may not work. But sometimes you just have to try right?

    That goes for ALL of you! Try something and hit or miss, at least you took a swing.

    So here are my pics of my swing at it. More to follow...... JR


    Locked the saddle down after some alignment..



    I think it was one pass at 1/16th" (maybe more like 1/8") depth. Didnt take long. The cast iron machined like butter. I did stone the top of the groove looking for burrs but cast iron doesn't leave a burr. Oh? For the machinist here. The step blocks look like they are at an "up hill" set. They are not. Its the pic. They are nose down. How bout my spacers though! Extra step block for packing



    While it was on the mill I milled the surface for the ball screw nut mount. The cast surface was not flat.



    Groove cut....



    And the flip side.....



    The Z slide... I dont like the slide for my mill. A lil too small for the weight carried but that will be a future issue..



    So anywho.... Thats that. Oil slots. Next up??? Concrete. Concrete???!!!!! What does that have to do with milling machines? Well? Im not sure but Ill let ya know what I did :cheers: JR
    (Note: The opinions expressed in this post are my own and are not necessarily those of CNCzone and its management)

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